Need Advice and Help Please!!!! Michigan

[melmag28]

I posted this in the prisontalk forums since I have an ex in prison and they give good advice on things but I need more input so here is the post I posted. Please read and send any helpful advice my way.

First of all I am looking for anyone that knows or has a friend that is a social worker that I can call or they can call me that is in Michigan. I don't care as to where they are in Michigan. I would just like to talk to one before I actually make a complaint cause I need to have some questions answered before hand.

I am currently living with my fiance. We have been living together for aprox 3 years now. He has 3 daughters and I have 2 sons. I always wanted a daughter but was lucky to get 3. Anyways everyone told me how crazy their mom was. Me, the way I think I make my own opinions cause you never know what to believe cause people can always extend the true when being pissed at someone. Needless to say what they all said was the whole truth.

Our first summer together she never came and got them and if he could even get her to see them he would have to drive all the way there and drop them off and go pick them up which was a total of 3 hours there and back and another picking them up. Which didn't happen all that much like 3 times out of 2 1/2 months.

During this summer she would call him to tell him (Dad) about the problems she had with her husband. Don't ask me why she would when she is the one who cheated and moved this guy in the day after he moved out, and expect him to care about her problems with her husband. She also slit up with her man several times during the summer. The reason he had the girls was because this guy choked one of his daughters. She finally decided she had everything turned around and she wanted the girls to go the school at her place. Me and him thought she was willing to get back in the swing of things and be there for the girls, so we let them go. We felt sorry for them and they were missing her.

OMG not even a week of them being there she is calling him and demanding him pay for this and that and he needs to step up and "be a father. be a man" WTH . I couldn't believe what I was hearing. Anyways he told her look I did everything for 7 months on my own so wait 7 months and I will then. He took them every weekend and every school break they had and every holiday. We took a weekend trip to Houston TX, and he got berated for that as well.

During the school season she had problems with his oldest daughter and would leave messages on my voice mail saying your daughters being a b**** and go on about her homework and not doing it. Also would call and say you need to have a talk with her blah blah then make comments like I have a life too. It was crazy. Every time he didn't do what she wanted she would talk bad about him to the girls and talk down to him in front of them.

About 3/4 through the school year his oldest daughter accused her husband of molesting her. His daughter later admitted she was trying to get rid of step dad and made it up. Then his oldest daughter started pulling out her hair and being very disrespectful to her mother. So her mom gets her this therapist which puts her on prozac and pills instead of trying to fix the real problem. She was upset that her mom lied to her about taking this guy back.

Well then her mom decided to send her our way cause she couldn't handle her and "mom needed to have a life too." So we moved her in once school was out. All of them stayed here for the summer and saw her on the weekends. Well the other 2 did his oldest didn't want to see her or even talk to her on the phone. The oldest called me mom once when she eventually did talk to her mom, which created a rift between them (jealousy?).

I explained to her mom that kids don't like to be put in the middle of things nor like bad being said about the other parent and they get upset. I tried my hardest to get his daughter tell her mom how she was feeling and work things out. Eventually she started seeing her mom and talking once again after about 2 months.

To make things short the last 2 years his daughter has been with us we have gotten her to stop pulling out her hair and her grades are in the B and C range with most of them being Bs. We have worked on her about her attitude and how she was always mean and nasty to people and now she has true friends and 2 best friends. We kept on top of her about her school work and made her turn missing work in and helped with homework. Her teachers all loved having her and she was always happy and even said that she is lucky to have us helping her.

Also during the whole course this from day one I noticed his girls were very needy and they cling to me like a leach. I wasn't use to all this. These 3 girls are acting like they were thriving for attention the the biggest way. I get about on average 20 hugs and kisses from the girls a day. They come to me when they need to talk, especially his oldest. It is always problems with their mother never about him and I tell them I will listen to them but if they want to get the problem solved they need to tell mom how they are feeling and fix the problem.

Ok back to making this short if I can. Last year their moms husband finally left. A few days later she had a new man and this time it was finally over with her husband. He has gotten the other 2 into after school things (which she has never done before he came along) Their mother and this guy got together not too long before his oldest was out of school the first year here.

During this summer we shared the kids but for some reason she wanted them to mainly stay with us so she could have her free time. Then the oldest asked mom what she thought about her moving back in beginning of summer. Mom told her, you are much better off at your fathers house. At that point his daughter started using whatever she could to make things look as bad as possible about her life at our house. By x-mas that year mom was convinced that things were horrible here and her daughter needed to move back in. Which wasn't fixing the real problem in the first place, so dad told them so, and disagreed with the idea. The idea then was to wait to see how things went this summer, 2007, to see how there relationship was.

Well this summer we tried very hard to work out an amicable schedule, because the last 2 summers the girls didn't get much time with there mom and they hated it. Even this went wrong. We decided that we would trade the girls on the weekends after a stay here or there. Which, of course, was HER way regardless. She always dropped them off ASAP, saturday, and picked them up as late as possible, sunday. If we even bothered trying to pick them up on a sunday or drop them off on a saturday. Well it was the same old tune... You're a bad father, your not a man (always said in front of the girls). BTW this always happens, all the nasty things she "has" to say are said in front of the girls.

I can go on and on about this whole mess but I am going to sum it up.
The reason I want to talk to a social worker is cause I want to know if what she is doing is really emotional abuse. I have been reading a lot about it. I am just so tired of them getting hurt. His oldest daughter told me she is always depressed and doesn't feel like living. She refused to have me get her someone to talk to. She even told me that she gets mad at her mom when her mom hugs her, but yet very much wants to be with her. She has most of the signs for emotional abuse and I feel like we are going backwards with her. Her mom calls them while they are here and drills them about whats going on and generally putting them in the middle.

Why can't she see the damage she is doing to these beautiful girls. They can be the sweetest loving girls but they have so much anger towards her but yet want the closeness badly. I notice his second oldest changing badly and she has always been the most lovable chipper girl. Her attitude and her outlook on things has been in a downward spiral for the last couple years. It hurts to see them this way. I am trying my hardest to get them to be happy.

She needs a good kick in the butt my someone that can get her to open her eyes. I know this was long I even left some stuff out. Just think this is just 3 years of stuff I seen. I know, from his family, that alot has happened even before me. Anyways thanks for reading and any help will be helpful

[IR_Efrem]

Dad

Well I am the father of the 3 daughters that melmag has mentioned. I just want to point out a couple simple things..

Our (my ex's and mine) custody agreement as filed and signed by the judge - Is as follows:

Full Legal and Physical Custody to Both parents
50/50 health care
50/50 child care
visitation and living arrangements to be decided by both parents
No child support paid by either parent

my daughters ages
14, 12, and 8

my oldest daughter is the one that has been living with us for the past 2 years

Thanks for your time

[turbowray]

Wow, that was a longer post than I write lol. Honey, it sounds like the mom and dad need to go to court to get custody and visitation in black and white, and judge ordered, so if one does not see them when they should, they have to answer to the judge. It sounds like the kids need stability in the visitation, and only a judge can force this woman to be consistant, and use it against her if she is not. Are you two married? I do not mean to sound mean, but if not, this is between him and her, and if you go into court blasting what YOU want, a good attorney can use that against you, and they will. Demands should be made by the father, never by you, and if they call you mom, you must explain that you are (name) and you love them with all your heart, but they need to call you your name, not mom, or a good attorney could use that against you also. I would take this woman to court, let a judge decide who has custody and visitation rights, and issue child support accordingly. If a judge gives your husband visitation, and her sole custody, the only positive thing I can say is, she MUST let him see them when the judge says so, not doing so would put her in legal trouble, and she could lose her some rights. I wish you guys the best of luck!! If you two were able to sit down and have concrete plans that involved the kids and where they were going to be, it would have been nice, but this woman according to your post, would drop them off when she wanted, but not take them when you wanted. To not allow you one half day without them, after you had them for two weeks straight, shows you that she is not a willing participant on working out details. Please remember though, she is mom, and you are the girlfriend (at least I think so), so you can not demand anything, tell her how to parent, or ask for anything in that matter, unless you want it to come back to you both in court. Your honey needs to fight for this!! What you can do is give him support, and love the childrend without discussing their mom during this time, it can be used against you both in court if you do discuss her with the kids. You can tell them you will always be there for them, because you will. The rest needs to come to an end in court, and if the children are old enough, they can speak up in court, and tell the judge what they feel their mom puts them through. Please get an attorney now!! You will lose without one. If the oldest needs counseling, the dad is the only one that can put her in it (or the mom), living with him, you don't have that legal right, and once again, if you do, the moms attorney will use that against you, trying to say that you are trying to take moms place, and make huge decisions without her consent, or the legal right to do so. In my book, you have earned that right, but my book is not the law, and the law is who needs to decide what in this matter. I will pray for you!!

[turbowray]

Well I am the father of the 3 daughters that melmag has mentioned. I just want to point out a couple simple things..

Our (my ex's and mine) custody agreement as filed and signed by the judge - Is as follows:

Full Legal and Physical Custody to Both parents
50/50 health care
50/50 child care
visitation and living arrangements to be decided by both parents
No child support paid by either parent

my daughters ages
14, 12, and 8

my oldest daughter is the one that has been living with us for the past 2 years

Thanks for your time

Sorry missed your post, it seems like you need to take mom back to court, because visitation and living arrangements are not being decided by both parents, mom is not sitting down and figuring what is in the best interest of the children, she is only going by what she wants. If you are ordered not to pay child support, and mom is blasting you for that in front of the kids, you can ask the judge to make her put a seal on it. It sounds like if child support is issued, she makes more than you, so even with joint custody, she may have to pay child support, if you asked for it to get amended. Your girlfriend sounds like she really really loves your children, but dad, you have to be the one demading things, and confronting the ex, the ex can and will use it against you if she continues to do so, when she has no legal right to even mention them to your ex. She sounds like the type to use anything she can get her hands on against you, so don't give her ammunition in court. It sounds like you can use it against her that she has not been working details out, the judge left you two to be mature enough to pick who will see who when, and if the mom just says no no no, she is not adhering to what the judge wanted. It may be that you just need to get that amended, and have specific days of visitation, and who will live where, judge ordered. Until you do this, since the judge did not put stipulations on the times of visiting, etc, she can jack you around all she wants. I wish you two the very best of luck!!!

[melmag28]

Need Advice and Help Please!!!! Michigan

Thanks for the advice. I just want to make some things clear me and him never discuss their mom to them or said anything negative about her to them. When they have a problem with her they always come to me and say can I talk to you and I always listen to them and the best advice I can give them is that they need to tell her how they are feeling. I tell them I can't fix the problem I can only give suggestions and them telling her how they feel is the best one. As much as I may think that their mother is a no good piece of crap I never let them know how I feel about her. I tell them to be lucky they have a mother that sees them and wants them and that some kids don't are not that lucky.

I know there is nothing I can do in court and that he has to do it all. All I can do is tell about what I have seen and heard. All I know is that something has to start happening where this girls are put first above everything. I can't make demands and I am not doing that either.


I have held my opinions back to her and have not said anything to to their mom about what she needs to start doing. I do not talk to her at all. When she calls I always give the phone to him or the kids. I have stayed back and stayed out of all this. I have only encouraged the girls to have a relationship with both parents. I am just to the point where I am tired of seeing them hurt and them crying to me and there is nothing I can really do but listen. It is sickening that a mother would do this crap to her kids. I have 2 boys and I would never put them through this nor bad mouth anyone to them. I feel they need to be kids and be happy and don't need to be in the middle of drama as kids.

He is going to court and getting this mess in order. Thanks for the prayers

[turbowray]

Thanks for the advice. I just want to make some things clear me and him never discuss their mom to them or said anything negative about her to them. When they have a problem with her they always come to me and say can I talk to you and I always listen to them and the best advice I can give them is that they need to tell her how they are feeling. I tell them I can't fix the problem I can only give suggestions and them telling her how they feel is the best one. As much as I may think that their mother is a no good piece of crap I never let them know how I feel about her. I tell them to be lucky they have a mother that sees them and wants them and that some kids don't are not that lucky.

I know there is nothing I can do in court and that he has to do it all. All I can do is tell about what I have seen and heard. All I know is that something has to start happening where this girls are put first above everything. I can't make demands and I am not doing that either.


I have held my opinions back to her and have not said anything to to their mom about what she needs to start doing. I do not talk to her at all. When she calls I always give the phone to him or the kids. I have stayed back and stayed out of all this. I have only encouraged the girls to have a relationship with both parents. I am just to the point where I am tired of seeing them hurt and them crying to me and there is nothing I can really do but listen. It is sickening that a mother would do this crap to her kids. I have 2 boys and I would never put them through this nor bad mouth anyone to them. I feel they need to be kids and be happy and don't need to be in the middle of drama as kids.

He is going to court and getting this mess in order. Thanks for the prayers

I believe you, I just don't want to see this woman accuse you of turning her kids against her, even if you have not! Please come back and let me know how it goes in court!

[IR_Efrem]

At it again...

Sorry missed your post, it seems like you need to take mom back to court, because visitation and living arrangements are not being decided by both parents, mom is not sitting down and figuring what is in the best interest of the children, she is only going by what she wants. If you are ordered not to pay child support, and mom is blasting you for that in front of the kids, you can ask the judge to make her put a seal on it. It sounds like if child support is issued, she makes more than you, so even with joint custody, she may have to pay child support, if you asked for it to get amended. Your girlfriend sounds like she really really loves your children, but dad, you have to be the one demading things, and confronting the ex, the ex can and will use it against you if she continues to do so, when she has no legal right to even mention them to your ex. She sounds like the type to use anything she can get her hands on against you, so don't give her ammunition in court. It sounds like you can use it against her that she has not been working details out, the judge left you two to be mature enough to pick who will see who when, and if the mom just says no no no, she is not adhering to what the judge wanted. It may be that you just need to get that amended, and have specific days of visitation, and who will live where, judge ordered. Until you do this, since the judge did not put stipulations on the times of visiting, etc, she can jack you around all she wants. I wish you two the very best of luck!!!

Dad here again.

This is already being planed as we speak, I am indeed taking this to court and so is my ex. I talked to the FOC about a week and a half ago, basically due to the arrangement/custody order, the court cannot currently do anything do enforce one thing or another so motions have to be filed to get anything done. It's all crazy because of mom not willing to listen or even try to hear what I have to say, and she is desperately trying to get things "her way" and if I don't agree the kids get to hear it all. Look at what dad is doing etc etc etc...

The current situation is as follows, she already has gotten a lawyer and filed a motion for custody. She discovered that my address info was wrong at their office and has already managed to get at least 1 hearing done without my knowledge, which is what she told me yesterday, and of course she was very proud of it. I could hear it in her tone and the words she used to tell me. Of course I am going to be at the FOC monday morning to get that small bit resolved and try my ****edest to get my voice heard in regards to her motion. I'll do whatever I have to.

Now let me backtrack to 2005. She filed a motion for support, to be paid by me to her, of course. At that time the current arrangement was (as agreed by me and mom). Our daughters resided in her home and went to school there. I had them every weekend (with exceptions of course), unless 1 had plans with friends or some such thing. I have NEVER interfered with my daughters plans or wants. Also per our agreement we split up vacation time from school, pretty much evenly, though they were with me more often than not. During the summer they were also here more often than at mom's. During the hearing this was all recorded by the case worker and she laid her demand on the table, which I didn't agree with. Oh and also I had called the court prior to the hearing date and they informed me that I was allow to call in for the hearing instead of being there. So the the hearing was done with mom there and me and the phone, with the speaker phone on. Anyhow the case worker said we aren't in agreement so they would do their own investigation, which was done. We both submitted the income info they wanted and they made the recomendation that no support be paid by me. So that was done and out of the way.

Fast forward to now. Yesterday my ex also told me that I never showed for that hearing and that I had my brother call in for it????? So that showed how irresponsible I was along with not updating my address info with the court and she also managed to keep repeating the word irresponsible several times.

Now these last two weeks have been fairly bad for my daughters. Mom told them that she had a lawyer and was going to have custody here real soon and that they would never have to come back to my house if they didn't want to. She said this RIGHT before they came here. *Small Child Translation* "Mom is going to keep us from Dad.* They were confused and upset needless to say. Basically they were complaining about getting their gameboy taken away from them and they were telling mom. So she took it as an opportunity to do a little psych warfare with the girls. "Look if you lived here you wouldn't have to worry about that." The girls were just trolling for sympathy and mom turned it into something ugly that they do not understand. I'm not new to this, the kids complain, because they can, when they are here and at mom's. I myself do not give in to this type of behaviour as it encourages the kids to play one parent against the other.

Anyway... She also told me that her lawyer says, she has a custody paper stating that I'm allowed to have the girls on the weekends and that they live with her on the weekdays. I know what this paper is, it's the notes that the FOC took down about our arrangement in 2005, in regards to our 2005 support hearing.

Let me backtrack to yesterday. I didn't have all the details, and I still don't, about exactly what mom is doing. Her telling the girls that they wouldn't ever have to come back to my house concerned me greatly needless to say, and the original plan was for our daughters to go back to mom's yesterday. Well I changed that, because of my concern about everything that has been said to them. So I told mom yesterday, that before the girls go back to her house I wanted to speak to a lawyer, the FOC, and the state so I can try to do what is best for the girls. Well she told me about the supposed custody paper I just mentioned and she also told me, if I didn't have the girls back on monday that she would call the cops and take them from my house. Let me also mention that she told the girls this as well. Which, of course has upset them even more.

There is so much more I could say about what has happened even in the last 2 weeks. I have all the custody agreements, past and present. I went to the county clerks office and got these copies myself. None of them mention anything about, me only having them on the weekends and her having them all week long. Can these notes be used to snag the girls any time she wants?

This has all been very taxing on all of us especially when I have to explain things like custody and mom is going to call the police, to little kids.

I'm not on a power trip, I just want my daughters to have loving, normal lives. There are no sides, just the futures of 3 very beautiful children. I do not HAVE to be the one with custody, this is not about wining or loosing. This is about trying to get mom do what is right by her daughters. I've been trying for so long but I only see one option. I honestly believe that they need to live here so mom can get some help and get her problems figured out.

Thanks for listening.

[moburkes]

OP, no offense, but the ONLY responses you will get will be from turbowray. No one else is going to read that long, long, long, long story. For someone else to even consider it, you would need to edit the original post, add some white (or blue) spaces, divide it up into paragraphs, etc.

[melmag28]

Thanks

I tried my best to sum things up a bit more. You really have no idea how much more I could put on here. It's not easy to tell one thing without telling another. Regardless i shortened things up more and split it up so it's easier to read.

Thanks for the suggestions

[GotSmart]

From my own experience;

Get a lawyer. Insist that the children speak to the judge, and provide a short numbered list of what the mother is doing. The fact that her new husband/boyfriend is abusive should give you full custody, with limited visitation. I could not read through that extremely long post myself, but got the general idea.

The father should do all the talking, as a step parent has limited power in court if any.

[Ohio "Step" Mom]

It (custody) goes by the last court order. She could have a Mt. Everest worth of "notes" but unless it is ordered and signed by a judge, that's all they are..... "notes".