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  • Safety in Relationships

    I have abook about it, "The Primal Teen". Recommended.

    i

    In article <[email protected]>, urf wrote:
    "Tracey" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]
    urf wrote:
    I'm looking for some consistency of position. One point is enforcing a
    teens
    responsibility a person. A philosophy of "you made your bed" sounds
    good
    but I think there are limitations to what we as parents should do to enforce
    our
    personal philosophies on our children. I don't get this, Urf. Sounds like you're saying that, as a parent, my personal philosophies should take a back seat to my child's. Going back to the 'teen is having a baby' discussion, I don't see where my child's hypothetical personal philosophy of 'I'm having a baby so I'm an adult and can do what I want. And what I want is for you to take care of my baby so I can go to school, pay for it's formula and diapers and all of the other things it will need. Take it to it's doctor appointments and get up with it in the middle of the night because I must sleep so I can go to school. And, since I'm still a teen, you can also pay for my cell phone, give me money for the prom, keep the baby so I can go out with my friends and have a life' trumps MY personal philosophy of 'Having a baby means your childhood is over.' Tracey
    There have been recent news stories on the development of teenage brains. http://news.independent.co.uk/uk/hea...p?story=540175 not on topic but interesting http://www.news-medical.net/?id=3233 http://www.charlotte.com/mld/observe...8962034.htm?1c excerpt from the above link "Brain maturity is a legal issue, too. When should children be held accountable for their actions, particularly when they have committed a crime? In the United States, juveniles are increasingly prosecuted as adults, despite recent advances in our understanding of brain development. In a 1999 study comparing the magnetic resonance images (MRI) of adolescent and adult brains, Dr. Deborah Yurgelun-Todd and other researchers at Harvard Medical School showed that immature brains actually work differently from mature ones. The part of the brain responsible for rational decision-making, impulse control, and foresight is the prefrontal cortex, the last part of the brain to mature. Because their prefrontal cortexes are not yet developed, adolescents use the amygdala in decision making, an imperfect substitute at best, since it deals with emotional responses, not rational thought." My view is this In the same way that a 2 year old is not responsible for "all" of their actions neither is a teen responsible for "all of their actions". Even though it would fit so nicely into a package and would make the world run so well. A toddler sees a cup of hot tea on the table. They are duly warned about the danger. The adult turns his/her head and the toddler spills the scalding liquid all over themselves. Clearly the toddler is responsible but could we also say that the parent is relieved of responsibility? Should the parent then say well you caused this so you must live with the consequences. Most parents would not do that and rightfully so. Most would rush to the aid of the burned child to comfort and mollify to whatever extent possible. In the same way a teen will make mistakes but in the case of a teen they are bigger more profound mistakes. Teens are NOT relieved of the consequences of their mistakes. Neither are parents relieved of the consequences of their children's mistakes. That is why we call ourselves families. Because disaster visited upon one affects all in the family. Those who would cast their children aside in the name of righteousness don't deserve to call themselves parents. Even those who would rid themselves of the child can never rid themselves of the knowledge of how they themselves behaved in the matter.

    Comment


    • Safety in Relationships

      In article <[email protected]>, glunk wrote:
      "Ignoramus32482" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]
      I think of baby sitting, within reason, as free entertainment. Not a chore, unless, of course, it takes way too much time. Just yesterday I spent almost the entire evening with my son, and it was rather pleasant. We went to a bookstore, goofed by the fountain, ate a potato salad at a cafe, bathed etc etc. People who view it as a chore, are missing out a lot. i
      A curiousity question... You spent the day with your own son. Do you call that "babysitting?" My FIL refered to my DH babysitting our kids. My DH got a confused look on his face and asked how caring for your own kids is babysitting? I am not trying to bust your chops. But I notice a lot of folks in my little circle of aqcuaintances see childcare as the Mom's thing. And Dad is the extra.
      English is not my native language and I may not be aware of all shades
      of the meaning of word babysitting.

      Please replace it with "spending time with a child" if you want a more
      generic term.

      i

      Comment


      • Safety in Relationships


        "Tony Miller" <[email protected]> wrote in message
        news:[email protected]
        On Mon, 12 Jul 2004 14:33:14 GMT, urf <[email protected]> wrote:
        "Tony Miller" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]
        <Snip>
        > I wouldn't expect any grandparent to be always on tap as a baby
        sitter
        but I
        > would want my child to have some free time to herself - if for no
        other
        > reason than I know what it's like to have the care of small children
        and
        > would have probably have gone loopy if I was never allowed free time with my
        > friends. Then the child earns the right to a social life (of sorts) -Tony
        Does a parent have to earn the right to be called a parent? Is simply having a child sufficient? Does one bail out every time there is
        something
        difficult to overcome? What example do you teach by disposing of errant children? WTF are you talking about?
        I suspect that understand you Tony.
        Was that an English sentence?
        Ooooppps. I left out the letter "I". It should have read......
        I suspect that "I" understand you, Tony.
        Now that should be pretty clear. The other part is pretty self explanatory.
        Do you want me to break it down further for you?








        Comment


        • Safety in Relationships


          "WhansaMi" <[email protected]> wrote in message
          news:[email protected]
          You could afford it. Would you buy your little granddaughter (that you
          did
          not want)cute little outfits? Estelle spends an inordinate amount of time eewwing
          and
          ahhingover cute little sundresses. I'd do what *I* wanted to do. That is the difference I see here. As I
          just
          wrote to Stephanie, I don't want there to be any misperception that I am a partner in this arrangement. Sheila
          I think that is perfectly appropriate.


          Comment


          • Safety in Relationships


            "glunk" <[email protected]> wrote in message
            news:[email protected]
            "WhansaMi" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]
            > I'm not sure what you mean here. Could you be more specific?>>> Babysitting?>> No, especially not for them to go out and "have a life". It would be> one of the ground rules for living with me: school, work and> parenting. No leaving the baby at home to hang out with friends.> Teen life would be over.That's very harsh and I think that would be a good way to induce misery
            to
            the point of actual depression in a young parent already struggling
            with
            her/his new responsibilities. We don't expect adult single parents to forgo
            a social life so why would we expect a teenager to do so?You seem to want to punish this hypothetical errant teen!I wouldn't expect any grandparent to be always on tap as a baby sitter
            but I
            would want my child to have some free time to herself - if for no otherreason than I know what it's like to have the care of small children
            and
            would have probably have gone loopy if I was never allowed free time
            with
            my
            friends.Tai Sure, as I've said, I'm not the only babysitter in the world. For most people, babysitters get used very judiciously **when they can be
            afforded**.
            When the teen parent can afford one, he/she can hire one. Sheila
            Luckily for me, my in-laws don't feel that way. They actually sometimes
            tell
            us we have not had a date in too long, why don't you guiys go out on Saturday. I am a lucky, lucky woman. S
            Estelle and I say that to our local children. I sometimes get too sensitive
            to
            the family dynamic. I personalize too much and get a sense (right or wrong)
            that they need some "us" time. I suggest that they do a movie and a diner.


            Comment


            • Safety in Relationships

              On 12 Jul 2004 15:33:13 GMT, Ignoramus32482
              <[email protected]> wrote:
              In article <[email protected]>, Tony Miller wrote:
              Not "I told you so". It's actions have consequences. Here are the actions, here are the consequences. If you do the action, be prepared to take the consequences. This is how adults have to live. When they go out in the big bad world, they are going to have to learn to do it without mommy wiping their nose when they get a sniffle. Sometimes a kiss and a band-aid won't help the kind of boo-boos they'll get into.
              The key is avoid extremes is either permissiveness nor mean spiritedness.
              Nya, nya, nya... "mean spirited". Nya, nya, nya !!!!!

              -Tony

              --
              "If the grass appears to be greener on the other side of the fence, it's time
              to fertilize your lawn!"
              Want to jump start your marriage? Consider a Marriage Encounter weekend.
              Check out http://www.wwme.org for more information.

              Comment


              • Safety in Relationships

                In article <[email protected]>, Tony Miller wrote:
                On 12 Jul 2004 15:33:13 GMT, Ignoramus32482<[email protected] > wrote:
                In article <[email protected]>, Tony Miller wrote:
                Not "I told you so". It's actions have consequences. Here are the actions, here are the consequences. If you do the action, be prepared to take the consequences. This is how adults have to live. When they go out in the big bad world, they are going to have to learn to do it without mommy wiping their nose when they get a sniffle. Sometimes a kiss and a band-aid won't help the kind of boo-boos they'll get into.
                The key is avoid extremes is either permissiveness nor mean spiritedness.
                Nya, nya, nya... "mean spirited". Nya, nya, nya !!!!!
                Hm, what are you trying to say here.

                i

                Comment


                • Safety in Relationships

                  Tony Miller wrote:
                  On Mon, 12 Jul 2004 10:32:04 -0400, glunk <[email protected]> wrote:
                  "Tony Miller" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]
                  On Sun, 11 Jul 2004 20:40:21 +1000, Tai <[email protected]> wrote:
                  <Mercy snip>
                  > the point of actual depression in a young parent already struggling
                  with
                  > her/his new responsibilities. We don't expect adult single parents to
                  forgo
                  > a social life so why would we expect a teenager to do so? An adult earns the right to a social life. Whatever. That sounds so ****ed ANAL I cannot quite get with that
                  program.
                  "Whatever". That's something my 14 year old would say. And if you don't want to "get with that program" it's fine with me. Raise your kids any way you want.
                  Personally, I would not feel the need to bust the kid's chops. Life will
                  be
                  plain difficult enough without me getting all punitive on him or her. If
                  the
                  teenager is going to make a success of being an adult, they still need
                  love
                  and support. And some breathing room. I would have lost my noddle if,
                  upon
                  bringing my brand new baby boy home, those around me thought I had
                  something
                  to prove before I could be allowed a helping hand. I certainly approve of holding the teenager who has chosen to be an adult to the standard that
                  they
                  have chosen. But not MORE than that out of some sort of punitive I Told
                  You
                  So. Not "I told you so". It's actions have consequences. Here are the actions, here are the consequences. If you do the action, be prepared to take the consequences. This is how adults have to live.
                  Free clue, Tony: They are NOT adults. It sounds like you're not being
                  the adult here, by not recognizing that.


                  Comment


                  • Safety in Relationships

                    glunk wrote:
                    "Ignoramus32482" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]
                    I think of baby sitting, within reason, as free entertainment. Not a chore, unless, of course, it takes way too much time. Just yesterday I spent almost the entire evening with my son, and it was rather pleasant. We went to a bookstore, goofed by the fountain, ate a potato salad at a cafe, bathed etc etc. People who view it as a chore, are missing out a lot. i
                    A curiousity question... You spent the day with your own son. Do you call that "babysitting?" My FIL refered to my DH babysitting our kids. My DH
                    got
                    a confused look on his face and asked how caring for your own kids is babysitting? I am not trying to bust your chops. But I notice a lot of folks in my
                    little
                    circle of aqcuaintances see childcare as the Mom's thing. And Dad is the extra.
                    I'll go out on a limb here and say that more often than not, Mom is probably
                    better at childcare, in most instances. (I know it's not in fashion to say
                    that now in this newage PC generation). After all, a child DOES come out
                    of a mom's womb, and that does give mom a *special* bonding. You can't
                    deny that.


                    Comment


                    • Safety in Relationships

                      In article <[email protected] t>, Bill in Co. wrote:
                      Free clue, Tony: They are NOT adults. It sounds like you're not being the adult here, by not recognizing that.
                      Not only they are not adults, they also have a little baby who is
                      definitely not an adult, and who needs help, attention, time, and
                      stuff bought for them. "teaching the child a lesson" that has a cost
                      of ruined childhood for a grandchild, is not wise at all.

                      i

                      Comment


                      • Safety in Relationships


                        "urf" <[email protected]> wrote in message
                        news:[email protected]
                        "glunk" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]
                        "WhansaMi" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]
                        >> I'm not sure what you mean here. Could you be more specific? >> >>> Babysitting? >> >> No, especially not for them to go out and "have a life". It would
                        be
                        >> one of the ground rules for living with me: school, work and >> parenting. No leaving the baby at home to hang out with friends. >> Teen life would be over. > >That's very harsh and I think that would be a good way to induce
                        misery
                        to
                        >the point of actual depression in a young parent already struggling
                        with
                        >her/his new responsibilities. We don't expect adult single parents to forgo
                        >a social life so why would we expect a teenager to do so? > >You seem to want to punish this hypothetical errant teen! > >I wouldn't expect any grandparent to be always on tap as a baby
                        sitter
                        but I
                        >would want my child to have some free time to herself - if for no
                        other
                        >reason than I know what it's like to have the care of small children and
                        >would have probably have gone loopy if I was never allowed free time
                        with
                        my
                        >friends. > >Tai Sure, as I've said, I'm not the only babysitter in the world. For
                        most
                        people, babysitters get used very judiciously **when they can be afforded**.
                        When the teen parent can afford one, he/she can hire one. Sheila
                        Luckily for me, my in-laws don't feel that way. They actually sometimes tell
                        us we have not had a date in too long, why don't you guiys go out on Saturday. I am a lucky, lucky woman. S
                        Estelle and I say that to our local children. I sometimes get too
                        sensitive
                        to the family dynamic. I personalize too much and get a sense (right or
                        wrong)
                        that they need some "us" time. I suggest that they do a movie and a diner.
                        My in-laws just want more time with the kids. Whatever. I will take it.


                        Comment


                        • Safety in Relationships

                          glunk <[email protected]> wrote:
                          Luckily for me, my in-laws don't feel that way. They actually sometimes tell us we have not had a date in too long, why don't you guiys go out on Saturday. I am a lucky, lucky woman.
                          Me too. I am now taking moment to count my blessings! And we did get
                          pregnant out of wedlock, so I suppose we are undeserving as well.

                          Comment


                          • Safety in Relationships

                            glunk <[email protected]> wrote:
                            Whatever. That sounds so ****ed ANAL I cannot quite get with that program. Personally, I would not feel the need to bust the kid's chops. Life will be plain difficult enough without me getting all punitive on him or her. If the teenager is going to make a success of being an adult, they still need love and support.
                            I'm with you. I am a huge believer in both natural consequences and
                            logical consequences, but the consequences of having a baby as a
                            teenager are so huge that I wouldn't feel the need to dream up more of
                            them to make a point. At that point it is punishment, IMO.

                            Comment


                            • Safety in Relationships

                              "glunk" <[email protected]> writes:
                              I guess I have something in common with your 14 yo. You have a hair across your ***, and I am fairly chill. Heck, I am so chill that at 36 years old I still say the word "chill." Oh, and "cool. " And "wicked" (NH thing).
                              Not jus NH. But I haven't heard it outside of New England. And I
                              don't _think_ I've heard it south of Boston even within NE.

                              The question I have is do _kids_ still say "wicked" or are you
                              actually dating yourself?

                              Comment


                              • Safety in Relationships


                                "Doug Anderson" <[email protected]> wrote in message
                                news:[email protected]_s03...
                                "glunk" <[email protected]> writes:
                                I guess I have something in common with your 14 yo. You have a hair
                                across
                                your ***, and I am fairly chill. Heck, I am so chill that at 36 years
                                old I
                                still say the word "chill." Oh, and "cool. " And "wicked" (NH thing). Not jus NH. But I haven't heard it outside of New England. And I don't _think_ I've heard it south of Boston even within NE. The question I have is do _kids_ still say "wicked" or are you actually dating yourself?
                                I have no idea. My son says wicked. But he is three, and he says whatever I
                                say. All of which is beside the point. Sometimes I get vaguely annoyed at
                                how strung Tony is. He could stand to "chill."

                                S


                                Comment

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