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  • #16
    I have to agree with restaurantowner12.

    Patty, I'm a small business owner and have owned 2 small businesses. Nothing big and nothing fancy. The current one I have had for about 19 years, and 7 years with the previous business. When times get tight, I'm not afraid to go work for someone else for a bit. So I may not have your expertise and schooling, but I think I know something that could help those that don't.
    I don't believe what I write, and neither should you. Information furnished to you is for debate purposes only, be sure to verify with your own research.
    Keep in mind that the information provided may not be worth any more than either a politician's promise or what you paid for it (nothing).
    I also may not have been either sane or sober when I wrote it down.
    Don't worry, be happy.

    http://www.rcfp.org/taping/index.html is a good resource!

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    • #17
      Jack, I'm sure you do. When the poster asks for legal advice, however, and I know the answer, I'll post it. When they ask for nonlegal advice about how a business should be run, you take it!
      I don't respond to Private Messages unless the moderator specifically refers you to me for that purpose. Thank you.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by hrmanager1
        and that we cannot tell her to use her breaks for restoom use because she is suppossed to be resting.
        You've gotten some advice from some knowledgable people but this statement was directly addressed.

        Yes, you can tell her that she should use her break and lunch times for trips to the "rest"room. She wouldn't find any law that can support her statement.
        Last edited by Sockeye; 09-11-2005, 06:07 PM.

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        • #19
          I don't know if this is coverred by ADA or not. It depends on facts you haven't listed here.

          That being said, what type of company wouldn't allow people enough time away from their "Workstation" to use the bathroom? What is wrong with corporate America?

          If you think she's "faking it", that's one thing, just make sure you are right.

          But if her issue is legitimate, then you'd better make some accomodations or risk getting sued and/or burning in hell.

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          • #20
            What kind of employee claims to need the restroom so desperately, but refuses to use her break time to use it?

            Sorry, I'm not buying that as a legitimate excuse.
            The above answer, whatever it is, assumes that no legally binding and enforceable contract or CBA says otherwise. If it does, then the terms of the contract or CBA apply.

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            • #21
              Employee shouldn't be forced to use only available break time using restroom any more than the employee should be forced to use only available breaktime taking insulin injections for diabetes.

              If it poses no undue hardship on the employer, additional break-time should be given so as to treat the employee fairly in light of the fact that employee deserves time both to 1) use restroom. and 2) to utilize breaktime for whatever else the breaks are normally utilized for.

              Besides, treating employees with a baseline level of respect, and having respect for human dignity, will benefit a company in the long-run. Employee discontent can ruin a company, rotting it from the inside. Small declines in productivity, significant increases in litigation, and increased turnover rates can take their toll on a company over time. Just because it is often difficult to see the cause-effect relationship between company personnel policies and harm to the corporate bottom-line, does not mean that such a relationship does not exist.
              Last edited by grasmicc; 09-12-2005, 08:26 AM.

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              • #22
                I'm not talking about forcing an employee to only use her break time; I'm talking about an employee who says she has to use the restroom frequently but then goes on to say that her break time is for her to rest and claims that her employer CANNOT make her use it. Well, guess what, if you can wait till your break is over then it can't be that urgent a need.

                How much time have you spent managing employees, grasmicc?
                The above answer, whatever it is, assumes that no legally binding and enforceable contract or CBA says otherwise. If it does, then the terms of the contract or CBA apply.

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                • #23
                  Okay, I may have been to hasty in my reply, the gentlemen asked for legal advice and I took it further, my apologies.

                  My point was that something this simple should easily be handled with a little discussion, possibly even compromise. It also bothered me that he said that they had other problems with this employee and I suspected that the bathroom issue was being used not to face the real issues at hand.

                  My apologies.

                  Restaurantowner12

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                  • #24
                    "I'm not talking about forcing an employee to only use her break time; I'm talking about an employee who says she has to use the restroom frequently but then goes on to say that her break time is for her to rest and claims that her employer CANNOT make her use it. Well, guess what, if you can wait till your break is over then it can't be that urgent a need."

                    You're assuming, without providing justification, that just because one needs to use the restroom frequently that they need to use it URGENTLY when the need does arise. Could you cite a medical authority for that assumption?

                    "How much time have you spent managing employees, grasmicc?"

                    This isn't relevant. However, just to proceed - less than you have, but I was paid more for it
                    Last edited by grasmicc; 09-12-2005, 08:57 AM.

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                    • #25
                      I don't think it's irrelevant. And how do you know how much I got paid?

                      I didn't think it could be many, since in a recent Family law post you admitted to being in your early 20's. Maybe when you've managed employees for as long as I have, you'll have a better idea when an employee's claim does and doesn't pass the sniff test.

                      I don't disagree with anything you've said on principle. But this employee's claims just don't stand up to any kind of believablity factor.
                      The above answer, whatever it is, assumes that no legally binding and enforceable contract or CBA says otherwise. If it does, then the terms of the contract or CBA apply.

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                      • #26
                        It's irrelevant. The strength of an argument is independent of the qualifications of its proponent. This is basic logic.

                        Likewise, my age is irrelevant, though you are correct that I am in my early 20's.

                        You don't know enough about the specific situation to know whether the employee's claim is true or not. Neither do I.

                        It would require a degree of situation-specific information, and specific medical knowledge, that neither of us have. I gave advice for two possible situations:

                        (1) the employee is lying.

                        (2) the employee is telling the truth.

                        In doing so, I acknowledge that either case could be true. My longer comments focus on the assumption that the employee is being truthful.
                        Last edited by grasmicc; 09-12-2005, 10:49 AM.

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                        • #27
                          And if you look carefully at my posts without making assumptions about what I am saying, you will see that at no time did I say that the employee IS lying or that the ADA does NOT apply. I offered my personal opinion as to the situation, based on my experience.

                          If the length of anyone's experience as a manager and your age is irrelevant, then so is how much I was paid.

                          And now I think that this has gone far enough. This thread is closed.
                          The above answer, whatever it is, assumes that no legally binding and enforceable contract or CBA says otherwise. If it does, then the terms of the contract or CBA apply.

                          Comment

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