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Changing Timecards Legal? Pennsylvania

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  • Changing Timecards Legal? Pennsylvania

    Is it legal for an employer to change my timecard for instance if I work 43.5 hours in a week I am legally mandated (not exempt) to receive OT. Can an employer legally change that 43.5 to 40 and refuse to pay me the OT which I am entitled? Can they change my time card in any way without me initialing the changes?

  • #2
    Originally posted by eric5775 View Post
    Is it legal for an employer to change my timecard for instance if I work 43.5 hours in a week I am legally mandated (not exempt) to receive OT. Can an employer legally change that 43.5 to 40 and refuse to pay me the OT which I am entitled? Can they change my time card in any way without me initialing the changes?
    No, they cannot. If you worked unauthorized OT, they can discipline you for up all the way up to termination, but they are required to pay you for time worked.
    Please no private messages about your situation.

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    • #3
      Clarification:

      There is no law that across the board prohibits making changes to time cards. Sometimes there are legitimate reasons to do so. Nor does any law requires that you sign or initial the changes, though it is an excellent idea to have that done.

      However, if the changes result in your not being paid for all the hours worked, THAT is illegal.
      The above answer, whatever it is, assumes that no legally binding and enforceable contract or CBA says otherwise. If it does, then the terms of the contract or CBA apply.

      Comment


      • #4
        I appreciate your clarification. Thanks.
        Please no private messages about your situation.

        Comment


        • #5
          Can they really terminate me for the overtime if it results from:

          Me normally being scheduled 34 hours a week.

          I am given a blanket order saying if I start with a client I am to finish with that client before I leave (by my immediate supervisor in the presence of two managers).

          I am told by management as a part time associate I am required to work a 5 hour shift on Monday (labor day).

          Five minutes before the end of my shift I receive a client which takes me an hour to complete.

          I am told by management I am required to work an 8 hour shift on Tues (7.5 with lunch). My normal Tues shift is only 5 hours.

          Also please note when I say normally scheduled 34 hours that is on paper which says for instance 9:30 on Friday but since you may not leave until you are dismissed by a manager can actually become 10:00 before all is said and done.

          Comment


          • #6
            You are sort of talking about two legally unrelated issues and maybe trying to tie them together when no such linkage exists in law.
            - Employers are required to pay Non-Exempt employee based on hours actually worked. Yes there are a few exceptions, but this is a very hard provision in the FLSA law, and the government is very serious about the enforcement of this rule. If the rule results in overtime, so be it. State DOLs are mostly serious about helping the employee with wage claims. Also, the government is very clear that schedules are legally meanignless.
            - Termination however is a function of the Common Law principal of Employment-At-Will, which predates the FLSA law and is legally unrelated to the FLSA. The original Employment-At-Will concept is that either side of the employment relationship can terminate the relationship "at will", no harm, no foul. Over time the concept has eroded somewhat with federal laws like Title VII and various state specific laws and court rulings. But the basic principal remains the same. Absent a contract or CBA, terminations tend to be legal unless a specific law was violated. Most states would consider a termination because you filed an overtime claim to with the state to be an illegal termination, but that is not what you are saying. If I am reading your comments correctly, your are saying that you have unpaid overtime, so any termination (should it occur) must be illegal. That is not what the law says.
            - You are also apparently saying that you are getting conflicting instructions from varies managers at your company. That is certaintly unfortuate, but it does not by itself protect you from being terminated. Employers do not necessarily need a good reason to legally terminate employees - they just need a reason that is not illegal. If you consider this unfair, many/most people would agree with you. But unfair and illegal are not the same thing.
            - If the termination actually occured (not clear from your posting), file a UI claim. People sometimes think that legal terminations and UI claims have something to do with each other. They mostly do not. Most terminations are legal, but many or most terminations also qualify for UI. Filing a UI claim is should be automatic for most terminated employees. There is no certaintity that the claim will be approved, but it is the state and not the employer who makes that decision.
            "Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away".
            Philip K. **** (1928-1982)

            Comment


            • #7
              DAW, you used to be a teacher, right?
              I don't respond to Private Messages unless the moderator specifically refers you to me for that purpose. Thank you.

              Comment


              • #8
                Nope. Just an accountant who trained a lot of staff over the years for large employers. If a supervisor does their job correctly, their staff gets hired into better jobs after a few years. It is hard to train someone to do their job correctly if you do not tell them the "why" as well as the "how" and "what". If they know the "why", then the exceptions will become obvious. I always preferred hiring inexperienced staff who did not have to unlearn all those strange made up "rules" that no one could support.
                "Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away".
                Philip K. **** (1928-1982)

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by DAW View Post
                  Nope. Just an accountant who trained a lot of staff over the years for large employers. If a supervisor does their job correctly, their staff gets hired into better jobs after a few years. It is hard to train someone to do their job correctly if you do not tell them the "why" as well as the "how" and "what". If they know the "why", then the exceptions will become obvious. I always preferred hiring inexperienced staff who did not have to unlearn all those strange made up "rules" that no one could support.
                  Me, too. At my most recent employer, I came into a department where the staff was told for 20 years "put this in that box and put write this number in red and put this number in green". After 20 years of processing virtually the same piece of paper over and over again, they never knew why they were doing it.
                  I don't respond to Private Messages unless the moderator specifically refers you to me for that purpose. Thank you.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Timecards

                    That is precisley why I photo copy my time card at the end of every pay period. I have found that my manager who does the payroll isn't always paying attention when calculating my hours worked. For instance, just last week, I noticed that I was short 5 hours on my check. When I brought this error to her attention, she just shrugged it off, and said she would put it on the next check. This is not the first time this has happened. In fact, I was to have 2 days vacation, and she neglected to put it on my paycheck. She, again, put it on the next payperiod. My other coworkers are now checking their's as well. I understand that we all are human, and to error is natural. But it gets old after a while.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      It just got a little more complicated... I am told by a few managers I know that my timecards are part of my records and I MUST be allowed to see / photo copy them. My manager has refused to allow me to see past time cards and has forbidden me from photocopying any current ones. Where does the law actually stand on this? PS: This same manager paid 2 of the 3 hours of OT as straight time.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by eric5775 View Post
                        It just got a little more complicated... I am told by a few managers I know that my timecards are part of my records and I MUST be allowed to see / photo copy them. My manager has refused to allow me to see past time cards and has forbidden me from photocopying any current ones. Where does the law actually stand on this? PS: This same manager paid 2 of the 3 hours of OT as straight time.
                        so call the DOL and file a complaint for unpaid wages....your manager WILL show the DOL your timecards

                        Comment

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