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Thread: Real Estate Listing - full price offer - refused!

  1. #1
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
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    Default Real Estate Listing - full price offer - refused!

    Another realtor question, sorry.

    Our realtor called & let us know there was a home for sale in the
    neighborhood that we wanted. We drove over to look it over before making an
    appt. for a viewing. While we were standing in the driveway, the owner's
    stepmother came outside. After a short conversation, she invited us into
    the house to look it over. The house needed some paint, and a carpet was
    scheduled to be installed in 2 days. After we left and talked it over, we
    called our agent and told him that we wanted to make an offer. We met and
    drew up the offer, full price, no contingencies, pre-approved financing,
    $500.00 earnest money. Our realtor called the listing agent to meet at the
    house. Listing agent said it could not be viewed until Wednesday. Our
    agent said we had already seen it and wanted to make an offer. The listing
    agent said he wished we wouldn't make an offer, because he had already made
    some appointments for Wednesday. We directed our agent to present the offer
    anyway, and we gave a 24 hour response time.

    About 1/2 hour before the expiration time, the seller's agent called and
    told our agent: he was uncomfortable about the earnest money and didn't
    think it was enough, he wanted to know what this conventional or FHA
    financing meant, which was it, and would we extend until next Friday. We
    could not make it to sign an extension in time, so we just said we would
    draw up a new offer, and fix the concerns he had. We did so. And gave 24
    hour response time again.

    We could not figure out why he was delaying, it was a full price offer. He
    did it again. When we drew up our 3rd offer, we increased the offer to
    $1,000 over asking price and extended the response time to Thursday (the day
    after his Wednesday). The seller rejected our offer because she received
    another this morning.

    The seller's agent is already gonna be reported and (hopefully) fined for
    listing the house in the MLS on 1/17 but not permitting showings until 1/28.

    When we spoke with the stepmother, she was so excited and happy, seemed an
    open and shut. We didn't take advantage of her being nice, we offered full
    price.

    Is there anything here, or with additional information, we can do? This
    buyer's agent apparently has a history of 'barely legal' listings and
    dealings. Appears to be some unethical type behavior, but I really wish we
    could identify something, anything.

    As an aside, is there any realtor rating service on the internet? Would it
    be legal to have such a site and allow people to post their experiences with
    real names?

    Thanks so much for any help.

    Judy



  2. #2
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Posts
    423

    Default Real Estate Listing - full price offer - refused!

    Judy and Dave G wrote:
    [made a full price offer on an MLS listing. Offer refused]
    Is there anything here, or with additional information, we can do? This buyer's agent apparently has a history of 'barely legal' listings and dealings. Appears to be some unethical type behavior, but I really wish we could identify something, anything.
    In every US state where I'm familiar with the laws, you can force the seller
    to accept your first, full price, offer. This inquiry should be first
    directed at your broker and then at a local attorney who handles real estate
    cases. Your broker should be able to refer you if you can't find a reference
    yourself.

    I'd say this is a simple case where you can force the sale if you wish to
    except for what I take the amazingly passsive position your broker seems to
    be taking here. That implies that there may be more here than you say or
    know. Remember, the listing broker is an agent for the seller and the
    seller is legally tied to his actions. This isn't a case where the seller
    can squirm out of the deal claiming the broker was being tricky because the
    agent's behavior binds the seller. This is a time for you to get off the
    Internet and first consult with your broker and then an attorney too.
    Advice isn't effective without action.
    As an aside, is there any realtor rating service on the internet? Would it be legal to have such a site and allow people to post their experiences with real names?
    I know of no such sites. Consumer rating sites are quite common (see
    epinions.com) so obviously legal as long as you don't post opinion as fact,
    but only as opinion.

    -paul
    ianal



  3. #3
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
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    1,242

    Default Real Estate Listing - full price offer - refused!

    Paul Cassel wrote:
    Judy and Dave G wrote: [made a full price offer on an MLS listing. Offer refused]
    Is there anything here, or with additional information, we can do? This buyer's agent apparently has a history of 'barely legal' listings and dealings. Appears to be some unethical type behavior, but I really wish we could identify something, anything.
    In every US state where I'm familiar with the laws, you can force the seller to accept your first, full price, offer.
    Only if all contingencies are agreed to, as well as the price.

    There are ALWAYS contingencies in real estate contracts.

    --
    This account is subject to a persistent MS Blaster and SWEN attack.
    I think I've got the problem resolved, but, if you E-mail me
    and it bounces, a second try might work.
    However, please reply in newsgroup.


  4. #4
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    421

    Default Real Estate Listing - full price offer - refused!

    Paul Cassel <paul1@abq.com> wrote:
    Judy and Dave G wrote:[made a full price offer on an MLS listing. Offer refused]
    Is there anything here, or with additional information, we can do? This buyer's agent apparently has a history of 'barely legal' listings and dealings. Appears to be some unethical type behavior, but I really wish we could identify something, anything.
    In every US state where I'm familiar with the laws, you can force the sellerto accept your first, full price, offer. This inquiry should be firstdirected at your broker and then at a local attorney who handles real estatecases. Your broker should be able to refer you if you can't find a referenceyourself.
    This is for discussion purposes only, and is not legal advice. I'm
    not a lawyer. If you want legal advice, hire a lawyer.

    I'm not aware of any such rule. A listing, MLS or otherwise, is
    considered a solicitation of offers to buy, not an offer to sell.
    A fairly common tactic in markets where demand exceeds supply is to
    list a home for less than it's true value. Then the seller gets
    several offers and invites the would-be buyers to bid against each
    other in an informal auction. When the bids stop arriving, the seller
    accepts the one he likes best.

    However, a full-price, _unconditional_ offer does trigger certain
    other conditions, having to do with the relationship between the
    seller and his agent. Basically, if the listing agent presents an
    offer at the asking price with no conditions (rare, but does occur),
    if the seller doesn't eventually sell the property for at least that
    much the seller will owe a commission based on that full-price offer.

    This doesn't do OP any good, of course.

    More to the point, the listing agent was remiss in not presenting OP's
    offer to the seller. It doesn't even matter if the offer was for less
    than the asking price. The would-be buyer could have submitted an
    offer to buy for $1 and the listing agent would have a fiduciary duty
    to the seller (his principal) to submit the offer. (Unless the seller
    has instructed him not to submit offers below some minimum.)

    I don't think there is anything that OP can do to gain the property at
    this point. What he _can_ do is complain to the listing agent's
    manager (assuming that the agent works for an actual broker), and to
    his state's realty licensing board. The listing agent clearly failed
    in his fiduciary duty to the seller, holding off for an offer that he
    (the agent) like better for reasons of his own -- possibly in conflict
    with those of the seller whom he represents. He should be subject to
    disciplinary procedures up to and including revocation of his license
    to act as a real-estate agent.

    Aside from that he should chalk it up to experience and find a more
    assertive agent to help him in his search for another property. He
    should make sure that he gets a "buyer's agent", who will look out for
    _his_ interests. In a typical real-estate sale, both the listing
    and showing agents are considered agents of the seller and have
    seller's interests in mind. But if you get a "buyer's agent", then
    your agent will represent _you_ and can (we hope) be more aggressive
    about making sure that your offer is presented -- and also help if you
    get into a counter-offer situation.

    The neat thing about getting a buyer's agent is that it doesn't cost
    you a cent. Your agent gets paid out of the commission that the
    seller pays his agent, and you don't spend a cent. Although if you
    want to motivate your agent to help you get a property for the minimum
    price, you can try to find one who will work on a "bonus" basis, where
    he gets some portion (e.g., 10% or 20%) of the difference between the
    maximum you're willing to pay for a property (written into your agency
    agreement) and the price you eventually end up paying for what you
    buy.

    _Do_ read your agreement with "your" agent carefully, whether you
    obtain a "buyer's agent" or continue to use the more common
    arrangement.
    I'd say this is a simple case where you can force the sale if you wish toexcept for what I take the amazingly passsive position your broker seems tobe taking here.
    No. If the seller's agent had presented the would-be buyer's offer
    and the seller had accepted that offer (in writing), then changed his
    mind to take one that he liked better, the first buyer could sue for
    "specific performance" to force the seller to sell to him. But until
    there is an offer _and_ acceptance _in writing_, there is no contract
    and the disgruntled bidder's only recourse is to complain about the
    agent's misfeasance.
    --
    I pledge allegiance to the Constitution of the United States of America, and
    to the republic which it established, one nation from many peoples, promising
    liberty and justice for all.


  5. #5
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    282

    Default Real Estate Listing - full price offer - refused!

    On Mon, 02 Feb 2004 08:43:35 -0500, Paul Cassel <paul1@abq.com> wrote:
    Judy and Dave G wrote: [made a full price offer on an MLS listing. Offer refused]
    Is there anything here, or with additional information, we can do? This buyer's agent apparently has a history of 'barely legal' listings and dealings. Appears to be some unethical type behavior, but I really wish we could identify something, anything.
    In every US state where I'm familiar with the laws, you can force the seller to accept your first, full price, offer. This inquiry should be first directed at your broker and then at a local attorney who handles real estate cases. Your broker should be able to refer you if you can't find a reference yourself.
    That rule would be inconsistent with the rule in every state that contracts
    to transfer real estate must be in writing and signed by the party to be
    charged. In this case the seller has yet to sign anything.

    I don't believe the rule you quote exists. I think that a full price offer
    might trigger having to pay a commission to the broker, but if the house
    was sold to someone else at the same or higher price, the broker would not
    have any damages to sue for.

    Isaac


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