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  • Everyboysmomma
    started a topic Ya....But....

    Ya....But....

    I have been reading this newsgroup for quite a while and starting posting a
    few weeks ago. I am reminded of my college Corporation Finance professor.
    He said, many years ago, that the biggest roadblock to success is the term
    "Ya, but". He went on to explain that whenever someone says these words, it
    means that they have heard what you had to say, but they are going to
    totally disregard your words, your expertise, your experience to continue on
    the same path that had them asking for advice in the first place.

    In so many posts here, I have seen many people repeat the exact same advice.
    For the most part, when many people respond in the same way, you might be
    able to ascertain that the advice is worth a consideration at least. Then
    comes the "Ya But". Then the posters go on to explain until they are blue
    in the face why what they are saying is at very minimum, reasonable. But
    the "Ya But-ers" continue with the notion that no one here is enlightened
    enough to understand the depth of their problem. I can only imagine that
    the same scenario happens at therapy, or when they are talking with their
    SO's.

    So, my quick, uneducated reaction is this. These people thrive on crisis.
    They don't *want* a solution to their problems because it makes them have to
    come up with new ones. Crisis keeps them the center of attention which is
    what they really desire.

    Comments?
    Momma




  • 22Ted
    replied
    Ya....But....

    Everyboysmomma wrote:
    I have been reading this newsgroup for quite a while and starting posting a few weeks ago. I am reminded of my college Corporation Finance professor. He said, many years ago, that the biggest roadblock to success is the term "Ya, but".
    Which negates anything you've said.

    He went on to explain
    that whenever someone says these words, it means that they have heard what you had to say, but they are going to totally disregard your words, your expertise, your experience to continue on the same path that had them asking for advice in the first place. In so many posts here, I have seen many people repeat the exact same advice. For the most part, when many people respond in the same way, you might be able to ascertain that the advice is worth a consideration at least. Then comes the "Ya But". Then the posters go on to explain until they are blue in the face why what they are saying is at very minimum, reasonable. But the "Ya But-ers" continue with the notion that no one here is enlightened enough to understand the depth of their problem. I can only imagine that the same scenario happens at therapy, or when they are talking with their SO's. So, my quick, uneducated reaction is this. These people thrive on crisis. They don't *want* a solution to their problems because it makes them have to come up with new ones. Crisis keeps them the center of attention which is what they really desire. Comments? Momma
    You gotta reach your personal rock bottom before it occurs to
    you that there's another way.

    Problem is, the deeper you get, the harder it is to extricate
    yourself.

    Momma, to me your point is seminal.

    You may think I'm missing the point, but...
    ever notice how we switch sides to align ourselves with
    whoever we identify with at the time? It's all me. Me. Me.
    Doesn't matter how I stick out, as long as I stick out.

    And I see a slightly different but related idea in
    these words (yes I know I keep posting the
    same quotes):

    "Addictions are desperate strategies by which
    we attempt to avoid the unimaginable terror of
    non-existence. ~ John Firman, 'The Primal Wound')

    - Michaela

    --

    "Most People are more comfortable with old problems
    than with new solutions."


    Leave a comment:


  • 22Ted
    replied
    Ya....But....

    Everyboysmomma wrote:
    I have been reading this newsgroup for quite a while and starting posting a few weeks ago. I am reminded of my college Corporation Finance professor. He said, many years ago, that the biggest roadblock to success is the term "Ya, but".
    Which negates anything you've said.

    He went on to explain
    that whenever someone says these words, it means that they have heard what you had to say, but they are going to totally disregard your words, your expertise, your experience to continue on the same path that had them asking for advice in the first place. In so many posts here, I have seen many people repeat the exact same advice. For the most part, when many people respond in the same way, you might be able to ascertain that the advice is worth a consideration at least. Then comes the "Ya But". Then the posters go on to explain until they are blue in the face why what they are saying is at very minimum, reasonable. But the "Ya But-ers" continue with the notion that no one here is enlightened enough to understand the depth of their problem. I can only imagine that the same scenario happens at therapy, or when they are talking with their SO's. So, my quick, uneducated reaction is this. These people thrive on crisis. They don't *want* a solution to their problems because it makes them have to come up with new ones. Crisis keeps them the center of attention which is what they really desire. Comments? Momma
    You gotta reach your personal rock bottom before it occurs to
    you that there's another way.

    Problem is, the deeper you get, the harder it is to extricate
    yourself.

    Momma, to me your point is seminal.

    You may think I'm missing the point, but...
    ever notice how we switch sides to align ourselves with
    whoever we identify with at the time? It's all me. Me. Me.
    Doesn't matter how I stick out, as long as I stick out.

    And I see a slightly different but related idea in
    these words (yes I know I keep posting the
    same quotes):

    "Addictions are desperate strategies by which
    we attempt to avoid the unimaginable terror of
    non-existence. ~ John Firman, 'The Primal Wound')

    - Michaela

    --

    "Most People are more comfortable with old problems
    than with new solutions."


    Leave a comment:


  • Bill in Co.
    replied
    Ya....But....

    Caren wrote:
    "JWB" <[email protected] actually, my e-mail is jwb3333 at excite dot com> wrote in message news:<%[email protected]> ...
    "Caren" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected] om...
    This group has taken on several personas over the years. The atmosphere in here has ebbed and flowed. 5,6, maybe 7 years ago, it was a place where many of became friends and formed two other groups as a result. Several of us met in person, some of us have exchanged Christmas gifts, had internet "grab bags" and truly bonded.
    I'm glad this group isn't like that anymore. It was still like that
    somewhat
    when I first came around (99), and it was annoying sometimes. I'd get
    into a
    debate with one person, and four others would prettymuch jump down your throat because you were arguing with their "friend". I've never been fond of "clique" groups. I'm a regular of this group (amongst several other online communities under a different name), but
    I'm
    no more special than any newbie. Yea, some people "know" me and know my style, and that can be an advantage (like if someone new says to me "you just hate children" most regulars could say "no, that's not correct").
    But I
    really didn't like the cliqui-ness that was here years ago. It made
    anyone
    with an opposing viewpoint feel very unwelcome. I'm glad it's gone. That being said, I do really like some of the people on here, and would
    not
    mind meeting them if the situation arose. I'd also throw an ASM party if
    I
    won the lottery But cliqui-ness... no, never liked that.
    Today I think that the group has become more of a place where strong minded people with strong wills exchange their views rather than offer advice.
    I don't see it that way. Some good pieces of advice come from strong
    wills
    and viewpoints. I'm not saying that no one here offers advice, in fact some
    advice in here in my opinion is darned good advice (especially for free!) However, I find that there are more stubborn and close minded folks than I have met in the past. I think that stubbornness prevents friendships from being formed, hence the atmosphere of this group being a kind of a hang out and let it all hang out. I absolutely do not feel safe enough in this group to let it all hang out due to much judgmentalism, I told you so's and my way or the highway type of thinking.
    Well, you may not get the hug you want, but I'll bet you get some good advice. Trouble is, the good advice may not be what you want to hear. JWB I always appreciate good advice. However having grown up with being spoken to as if I was a peice of garbage, to me how advice is presented is as important as the advice that is presented. Just like when I look at studies and who funded the study, I look at advice and who offered the advice. There are many in here who I do respect. I don't need hugs in here- I do appreciate respect though.
    I like debating with you Caren, at least on the ones you respond to. :-)


    Leave a comment:


  • Bill in Co.
    replied
    Ya....But....

    Caren wrote:
    "JWB" <[email protected] actually, my e-mail is jwb3333 at excite dot com> wrote in message news:<%[email protected]> ...
    "Caren" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected] om...
    This group has taken on several personas over the years. The atmosphere in here has ebbed and flowed. 5,6, maybe 7 years ago, it was a place where many of became friends and formed two other groups as a result. Several of us met in person, some of us have exchanged Christmas gifts, had internet "grab bags" and truly bonded.
    I'm glad this group isn't like that anymore. It was still like that
    somewhat
    when I first came around (99), and it was annoying sometimes. I'd get
    into a
    debate with one person, and four others would prettymuch jump down your throat because you were arguing with their "friend". I've never been fond of "clique" groups. I'm a regular of this group (amongst several other online communities under a different name), but
    I'm
    no more special than any newbie. Yea, some people "know" me and know my style, and that can be an advantage (like if someone new says to me "you just hate children" most regulars could say "no, that's not correct").
    But I
    really didn't like the cliqui-ness that was here years ago. It made
    anyone
    with an opposing viewpoint feel very unwelcome. I'm glad it's gone. That being said, I do really like some of the people on here, and would
    not
    mind meeting them if the situation arose. I'd also throw an ASM party if
    I
    won the lottery But cliqui-ness... no, never liked that.
    Today I think that the group has become more of a place where strong minded people with strong wills exchange their views rather than offer advice.
    I don't see it that way. Some good pieces of advice come from strong
    wills
    and viewpoints. I'm not saying that no one here offers advice, in fact some
    advice in here in my opinion is darned good advice (especially for free!) However, I find that there are more stubborn and close minded folks than I have met in the past. I think that stubbornness prevents friendships from being formed, hence the atmosphere of this group being a kind of a hang out and let it all hang out. I absolutely do not feel safe enough in this group to let it all hang out due to much judgmentalism, I told you so's and my way or the highway type of thinking.
    Well, you may not get the hug you want, but I'll bet you get some good advice. Trouble is, the good advice may not be what you want to hear. JWB I always appreciate good advice. However having grown up with being spoken to as if I was a peice of garbage, to me how advice is presented is as important as the advice that is presented. Just like when I look at studies and who funded the study, I look at advice and who offered the advice. There are many in here who I do respect. I don't need hugs in here- I do appreciate respect though.
    I like debating with you Caren, at least on the ones you respond to. :-)


    Leave a comment:


  • JWB
    replied
    Ya....But....

    "Caren" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected] om...
    "JWB" <[email protected] actually, my e-mail is jwb3333 at excite
    dot com> wrote in message
    news:<%[email protected]> ...
    "Caren" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected] om...
    This group has taken on several personas over the years. The atmosphere in here has ebbed and flowed. 5,6, maybe 7 years ago, it was a place where many of became friends and formed two other groups as a result. Several of us met in person, some of us have exchanged Christmas gifts, had internet "grab bags" and truly bonded.
    I'm glad this group isn't like that anymore. It was still like that
    somewhat
    when I first came around (99), and it was annoying sometimes. I'd get
    into a
    debate with one person, and four others would prettymuch jump down your throat because you were arguing with their "friend". I've never been fond of "clique" groups. I'm a regular of this group (amongst several other online communities under a different name), but
    I'm
    no more special than any newbie. Yea, some people "know" me and know my style, and that can be an advantage (like if someone new says to me "you just hate children" most regulars could say "no, that's not correct").
    But I
    really didn't like the cliqui-ness that was here years ago. It made
    anyone
    with an opposing viewpoint feel very unwelcome. I'm glad it's gone. That being said, I do really like some of the people on here, and would
    not
    mind meeting them if the situation arose. I'd also throw an ASM party if
    I
    won the lottery But cliqui-ness... no, never liked that.
    Today I think that the group has become more of a place where strong minded people with strong wills exchange their views rather than offer advice.
    I don't see it that way. Some good pieces of advice come from strong
    wills
    and viewpoints. I'm not saying that no one here offers advice, in fact some
    advice in here in my opinion is darned good advice (especially for free!) However, I find that there are more stubborn and close minded folks than I have met in the past. I think that stubbornness prevents friendships from being formed, hence the atmosphere of this group being a kind of a hang out and let it all hang out. I absolutely do not feel safe enough in this group to let it all hang out due to much judgmentalism, I told you so's and my way or the highway type of thinking.
    Well, you may not get the hug you want, but I'll bet you get some good advice. Trouble is, the good advice may not be what you want to hear. JWB I always appreciate good advice. However having grown up with being spoken to as if I was a peice of garbage, to me how advice is presented is as important as the advice that is presented. Just like when I look at studies and who funded the study, I look at advice and who offered the advice. There are many in here who I do respect. I don't need hugs in here- I do appreciate respect though.
    which I think you get. From most of us, anyway


    Leave a comment:


  • JWB
    replied
    Ya....But....

    "Caren" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected] om...
    "JWB" <[email protected] actually, my e-mail is jwb3333 at excite
    dot com> wrote in message
    news:<%[email protected]> ...
    "Caren" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected] om...
    This group has taken on several personas over the years. The atmosphere in here has ebbed and flowed. 5,6, maybe 7 years ago, it was a place where many of became friends and formed two other groups as a result. Several of us met in person, some of us have exchanged Christmas gifts, had internet "grab bags" and truly bonded.
    I'm glad this group isn't like that anymore. It was still like that
    somewhat
    when I first came around (99), and it was annoying sometimes. I'd get
    into a
    debate with one person, and four others would prettymuch jump down your throat because you were arguing with their "friend". I've never been fond of "clique" groups. I'm a regular of this group (amongst several other online communities under a different name), but
    I'm
    no more special than any newbie. Yea, some people "know" me and know my style, and that can be an advantage (like if someone new says to me "you just hate children" most regulars could say "no, that's not correct").
    But I
    really didn't like the cliqui-ness that was here years ago. It made
    anyone
    with an opposing viewpoint feel very unwelcome. I'm glad it's gone. That being said, I do really like some of the people on here, and would
    not
    mind meeting them if the situation arose. I'd also throw an ASM party if
    I
    won the lottery But cliqui-ness... no, never liked that.
    Today I think that the group has become more of a place where strong minded people with strong wills exchange their views rather than offer advice.
    I don't see it that way. Some good pieces of advice come from strong
    wills
    and viewpoints. I'm not saying that no one here offers advice, in fact some
    advice in here in my opinion is darned good advice (especially for free!) However, I find that there are more stubborn and close minded folks than I have met in the past. I think that stubbornness prevents friendships from being formed, hence the atmosphere of this group being a kind of a hang out and let it all hang out. I absolutely do not feel safe enough in this group to let it all hang out due to much judgmentalism, I told you so's and my way or the highway type of thinking.
    Well, you may not get the hug you want, but I'll bet you get some good advice. Trouble is, the good advice may not be what you want to hear. JWB I always appreciate good advice. However having grown up with being spoken to as if I was a peice of garbage, to me how advice is presented is as important as the advice that is presented. Just like when I look at studies and who funded the study, I look at advice and who offered the advice. There are many in here who I do respect. I don't need hugs in here- I do appreciate respect though.
    which I think you get. From most of us, anyway


    Leave a comment:


  • Caren
    replied
    Ya....But....

    "JWB" <[email protected] actually, my e-mail is jwb3333 at excite dot com> wrote in message news:<%[email protected]> ...
    "Caren" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected] om...
    This group has taken on several personas over the years. The atmosphere in here has ebbed and flowed. 5,6, maybe 7 years ago, it was a place where many of became friends and formed two other groups as a result. Several of us met in person, some of us have exchanged Christmas gifts, had internet "grab bags" and truly bonded.
    I'm glad this group isn't like that anymore. It was still like that somewhat when I first came around (99), and it was annoying sometimes. I'd get into a debate with one person, and four others would prettymuch jump down your throat because you were arguing with their "friend". I've never been fond of "clique" groups. I'm a regular of this group (amongst several other online communities under a different name), but I'm no more special than any newbie. Yea, some people "know" me and know my style, and that can be an advantage (like if someone new says to me "you just hate children" most regulars could say "no, that's not correct"). But I really didn't like the cliqui-ness that was here years ago. It made anyone with an opposing viewpoint feel very unwelcome. I'm glad it's gone. That being said, I do really like some of the people on here, and would not mind meeting them if the situation arose. I'd also throw an ASM party if I won the lottery But cliqui-ness... no, never liked that.
    Today I think that the group has become more of a place where strong minded people with strong wills exchange their views rather than offer advice.
    I don't see it that way. Some good pieces of advice come from strong wills and viewpoints. I'm not saying that no one here offers advice, in fact some
    advice in here in my opinion is darned good advice (especially for free!) However, I find that there are more stubborn and close minded folks than I have met in the past. I think that stubbornness prevents friendships from being formed, hence the atmosphere of this group being a kind of a hang out and let it all hang out. I absolutely do not feel safe enough in this group to let it all hang out due to much judgmentalism, I told you so's and my way or the highway type of thinking.
    Well, you may not get the hug you want, but I'll bet you get some good advice. Trouble is, the good advice may not be what you want to hear. JWB
    I always appreciate good advice. However having grown up with being
    spoken to as if I was a peice of garbage, to me how advice is
    presented is as important as the advice that is presented. Just like
    when I look at studies and who funded the study, I look at advice and
    who offered the advice. There are many in here who I do respect.

    I don't need hugs in here- I do appreciate respect though.

    Leave a comment:


  • Caren
    replied
    Ya....But....

    "JWB" <[email protected] actually, my e-mail is jwb3333 at excite dot com> wrote in message news:<%[email protected]> ...
    "Caren" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected] om...
    This group has taken on several personas over the years. The atmosphere in here has ebbed and flowed. 5,6, maybe 7 years ago, it was a place where many of became friends and formed two other groups as a result. Several of us met in person, some of us have exchanged Christmas gifts, had internet "grab bags" and truly bonded.
    I'm glad this group isn't like that anymore. It was still like that somewhat when I first came around (99), and it was annoying sometimes. I'd get into a debate with one person, and four others would prettymuch jump down your throat because you were arguing with their "friend". I've never been fond of "clique" groups. I'm a regular of this group (amongst several other online communities under a different name), but I'm no more special than any newbie. Yea, some people "know" me and know my style, and that can be an advantage (like if someone new says to me "you just hate children" most regulars could say "no, that's not correct"). But I really didn't like the cliqui-ness that was here years ago. It made anyone with an opposing viewpoint feel very unwelcome. I'm glad it's gone. That being said, I do really like some of the people on here, and would not mind meeting them if the situation arose. I'd also throw an ASM party if I won the lottery But cliqui-ness... no, never liked that.
    Today I think that the group has become more of a place where strong minded people with strong wills exchange their views rather than offer advice.
    I don't see it that way. Some good pieces of advice come from strong wills and viewpoints. I'm not saying that no one here offers advice, in fact some
    advice in here in my opinion is darned good advice (especially for free!) However, I find that there are more stubborn and close minded folks than I have met in the past. I think that stubbornness prevents friendships from being formed, hence the atmosphere of this group being a kind of a hang out and let it all hang out. I absolutely do not feel safe enough in this group to let it all hang out due to much judgmentalism, I told you so's and my way or the highway type of thinking.
    Well, you may not get the hug you want, but I'll bet you get some good advice. Trouble is, the good advice may not be what you want to hear. JWB
    I always appreciate good advice. However having grown up with being
    spoken to as if I was a peice of garbage, to me how advice is
    presented is as important as the advice that is presented. Just like
    when I look at studies and who funded the study, I look at advice and
    who offered the advice. There are many in here who I do respect.

    I don't need hugs in here- I do appreciate respect though.

    Leave a comment:


  • Seeker
    replied
    Ya....But....

    "Tai" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    That's my impression, too. People don't often make immediate changes to their thinking or behaviour. It happens in small increments. I see a lot
    of
    Yah Butting coming from people who haven't quite reached the place where what is being said to them can be truly understood. There's too much else that has to be understood first.
    Another comment on this. Sometimes the required change is, for all
    practical purposes, all or nothing -- there are no small increments
    possible. Or, even if that isn't the case, it seems enough so that it might
    as well be.

    Ted


    Leave a comment:


  • Seeker
    replied
    Ya....But....

    "Tai" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    That's my impression, too. People don't often make immediate changes to their thinking or behaviour. It happens in small increments. I see a lot
    of
    Yah Butting coming from people who haven't quite reached the place where what is being said to them can be truly understood. There's too much else that has to be understood first.
    Another comment on this. Sometimes the required change is, for all
    practical purposes, all or nothing -- there are no small increments
    possible. Or, even if that isn't the case, it seems enough so that it might
    as well be.

    Ted


    Leave a comment:


  • Bill in Co.
    replied
    Ya....But....

    Caren wrote:
    "Bill in Co." <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected] hlink.net>...
    shinypenny wrote:
    "Everyboysmomma" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]> ...> I have been reading this newsgroup for quite a while and starting
    posting
    > a few weeks ago. I am reminded of my college Corporation Finance professor.
    > He said, many years ago, that the biggest roadblock to success is the
    term
    > "Ya, but". He went on to explain that whenever someone says these
    words,
    > it means that they have heard what you had to say, but they are going
    to
    > totally disregard your words, your expertise, your experience to
    continue
    > on the same path that had them asking for advice in the first place.>> In so many posts here, I have seen many people repeat the exact same advice.
    > For the most part, when many people respond in the same way, you might
    be
    > able to ascertain that the advice is worth a consideration at least.
    Then
    > comes the "Ya But". Then the posters go on to explain until they are
    blue
    > in the face why what they are saying is at very minimum, reasonable.
    But
    > the "Ya But-ers" continue with the notion that no one here is
    enlightened
    > enough to understand the depth of their problem. I can only imagine
    that
    > the same scenario happens at therapy, or when they are talking with
    their
    > SO's.>> So, my quick, uneducated reaction is this. These people thrive on
    crisis.
    > They don't *want* a solution to their problems because it makes them
    have
    > to come up with new ones. Crisis keeps them the center of attention
    which
    >is what they really desire. Absolutely. This can be one of those "Games People Play." You can spot when it's purely a game (versus stubborn self-denial) when people run out of suggestions, and the OP reacts with what seems almost to be glee (Ted is known to do this quite often). The payoff is not just attention, but it's the satisfaction of stumping everyone. For Ted there's also an element of "I'm so special" going on: "my problems are so unique and difficult, none of you can figure out a solution!" For many people, this game is merely a pasttime, a way of dealing with boredom. I've pointed this out frequently to Ted. I really believe he's thoroughly bored with his life, and that's the root cause of his troubles. jen Then the solution is for him to change his life, n'est pas? Que vous incite nous penser parle de Ted ? Je pensais vous !
    Nah, Ted first. We're talking about Ted. (Besides which, you didn't
    answer all my other posts, so there)!


    Leave a comment:


  • Bill in Co.
    replied
    Ya....But....

    Caren wrote:
    "Bill in Co." <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected] hlink.net>...
    shinypenny wrote:
    "Everyboysmomma" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]> ...> I have been reading this newsgroup for quite a while and starting
    posting
    > a few weeks ago. I am reminded of my college Corporation Finance professor.
    > He said, many years ago, that the biggest roadblock to success is the
    term
    > "Ya, but". He went on to explain that whenever someone says these
    words,
    > it means that they have heard what you had to say, but they are going
    to
    > totally disregard your words, your expertise, your experience to
    continue
    > on the same path that had them asking for advice in the first place.>> In so many posts here, I have seen many people repeat the exact same advice.
    > For the most part, when many people respond in the same way, you might
    be
    > able to ascertain that the advice is worth a consideration at least.
    Then
    > comes the "Ya But". Then the posters go on to explain until they are
    blue
    > in the face why what they are saying is at very minimum, reasonable.
    But
    > the "Ya But-ers" continue with the notion that no one here is
    enlightened
    > enough to understand the depth of their problem. I can only imagine
    that
    > the same scenario happens at therapy, or when they are talking with
    their
    > SO's.>> So, my quick, uneducated reaction is this. These people thrive on
    crisis.
    > They don't *want* a solution to their problems because it makes them
    have
    > to come up with new ones. Crisis keeps them the center of attention
    which
    >is what they really desire. Absolutely. This can be one of those "Games People Play." You can spot when it's purely a game (versus stubborn self-denial) when people run out of suggestions, and the OP reacts with what seems almost to be glee (Ted is known to do this quite often). The payoff is not just attention, but it's the satisfaction of stumping everyone. For Ted there's also an element of "I'm so special" going on: "my problems are so unique and difficult, none of you can figure out a solution!" For many people, this game is merely a pasttime, a way of dealing with boredom. I've pointed this out frequently to Ted. I really believe he's thoroughly bored with his life, and that's the root cause of his troubles. jen Then the solution is for him to change his life, n'est pas? Que vous incite nous penser parle de Ted ? Je pensais vous !
    Nah, Ted first. We're talking about Ted. (Besides which, you didn't
    answer all my other posts, so there)!


    Leave a comment:


  • Tai
    replied
    Ya....But....


    "Seeker" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:050820042240427532%[email protected] om...
    In article <[email protected]>, Tai <[email protected]> wrote:
    That's my impression, too. People don't often make immediate changes to their thinking or behaviour. It happens in small increments. I see a lot
    of
    Yah Butting coming from people who haven't quite reached the place where what is being said to them can be truly understood. There's too much
    else
    that has to be understood first. I don't think it has a thing to do with understanding.
    It doesn't surprise me that you think that.
    Deep emotional issues are not resolved be rational arguments.
    They are resolved by understanding why we do the things we do and working on
    ways to change our behaviour when we are ready to want to. You can make your
    statement as often as *you* want to but it won't change my opinion because
    mine is based on my own experience.

    You don't value change more than you value the status quo. Until and if that
    alters, neither will you.

    tai


    Leave a comment:


  • Tai
    replied
    Ya....But....


    "Seeker" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:050820042240427532%[email protected] om...
    In article <[email protected]>, Tai <[email protected]> wrote:
    That's my impression, too. People don't often make immediate changes to their thinking or behaviour. It happens in small increments. I see a lot
    of
    Yah Butting coming from people who haven't quite reached the place where what is being said to them can be truly understood. There's too much
    else
    that has to be understood first. I don't think it has a thing to do with understanding.
    It doesn't surprise me that you think that.
    Deep emotional issues are not resolved be rational arguments.
    They are resolved by understanding why we do the things we do and working on
    ways to change our behaviour when we are ready to want to. You can make your
    statement as often as *you* want to but it won't change my opinion because
    mine is based on my own experience.

    You don't value change more than you value the status quo. Until and if that
    alters, neither will you.

    tai


    Leave a comment:

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