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What Reasons Warrants A Police Officer to take a polygraph Alaska

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  • What Reasons Warrants A Police Officer to take a polygraph Alaska

    I am an Alaska Police Office in a small rule SE town. I was dispatched to a call while I was teaching a class in the elementary school. I am not allowed to be armed inside the school so I went to the scene and defused the situation and had the son to leave the residence which is what the mother requested of me. I had responded two other times to this same family and removed the son. He is a repeat call when he gets off his meds. He demands money from his mom. She has told me in the past that she is not afraid of him. He has never been violent with me. She filed a complaint two weeks after the incident and said I had not protected her by not having a weapon. I was under investigation by the SGt. and the chief requested I take a polygraph for the incident in reference to having my gun with me. He said I failed the polygraph and I was put on suspension. I am certain I will be fired. Do you believe the action warranted a polygraph. Thanks for a your help as soon as possible. Is it illegal for our agency not to have current State and Federal Posters posted in our agency.

    thanks

    Rick
    I have 15 years of law enforcement experience.

  • Alaskapopo
    replied
    Originally posted by cbg View Post
    Um, you do realize that this thread is from seven years ago and the situation is long since resolved, right?
    Sorry for the necroposting. Did not pay enough attention to the dates.
    Pat

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  • cbg
    replied
    Um, you do realize that this thread is from seven years ago and the situation is long since resolved, right?

    Leave a comment:


  • Alaskapopo
    replied
    Originally posted by rjwalker View Post
    I am an Alaska Police Office in a small rule SE town. I was dispatched to a call while I was teaching a class in the elementary school. I am not allowed to be armed inside the school so I went to the scene and defused the situation and had the son to leave the residence which is what the mother requested of me. I had responded two other times to this same family and removed the son. He is a repeat call when he gets off his meds. He demands money from his mom. She has told me in the past that she is not afraid of him. He has never been violent with me. She filed a complaint two weeks after the incident and said I had not protected her by not having a weapon. I was under investigation by the SGt. and the chief requested I take a polygraph for the incident in reference to having my gun with me. He said I failed the polygraph and I was put on suspension. I am certain I will be fired. Do you believe the action warranted a polygraph. Thanks for a your help as soon as possible. Is it illegal for our agency not to have current State and Federal Posters posted in our agency.

    thanks

    Rick
    I have 15 years of law enforcement experience.
    Schools can not stop an on duty officer from carrying his weapon on school grounds. Not having your weapon while on duty is a serious serious violation in most of the departments I have worked. Something sounds fishy. I worked as an SRO and as a DARE officer earlier in my career. No way I would go anywhere on duty without my weapon. As for the polygraph yes they can use it and frankly we do in discipline situations where the officer does not admit what happened and we are very confident in what happened. There are some agencies that are protected from polygraphs by their union contract.
    Pat
    Last edited by Alaskapopo; 02-03-2013, 03:45 PM.

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  • rjc
    replied
    Originally posted by rjwalker View Post
    We are represented by Local 71. It is the sorriest union I have ever known of. They refuse to get in volved in anything concerning department OPM's. I have not had any representation from them.
    As previoulsy stated, they cannot refuse to represent you otherwise they would be subject to legal action. IYou need to contact them ASAP. If they provide anything less than zealous advocacy, then you need to contact higher-ups and/or seek local labor counsel. It is my best guess that Local 71 is part of a bigger national organization ... ?

    It is very likely that this action either violated your CBA and/or past practice and may constitute an unfair labor practice. I cannot believe your fellow police officers can be happy about this and the more thr union hears about the more they will feel the pressure to take action.

    Leave a comment:


  • stiffnecked
    replied
    I have never heard anything good about Local 71. That's why most of the other departments are trying to go with PSEA. That said, Local 71 has a duty to represent you. If they don't then you have cause for action against them. It may be time to give a call to a good labor attorney in Anchorage. If you can't find one let me know.

    Leave a comment:


  • rjwalker
    replied
    Poloygraph

    We are represented by Local 71. It is the sorriest union I have ever known of. They refuse to get in volved in anything concerning department OPM's. I have not had any representation from them.

    Leave a comment:


  • rjwalker
    replied
    Polygraph

    I would not have had a problem at all with the polygraph if this had been past presidence in the agency when complaints were filed against other employees, including our chief. I think the test was inconclusive because it said I lied on the two questions. Did I have my weapon and did I feel the complaintant was afraid of her son. I did have my weapon and I had meet with her that day at the court house where she refused "on tape" a protective order and stated that she was not afraid of her son. My boss knows I have these witnesses but does not care. I know I was telling the truth. There are personal issues between the chief and I concerning my wife who is an ex dispatcher. He is not professional enough to not blame me for her actions. He does not care how good an employee I am he is concerned more about getting to her. I am certain, even with witnesses I will be fired this week. I think he will use this to his advantage and opportunity to get rid of me. I am curious if I have gounds to sue the Agency naming him for an incomplete investigation. Handling my complaint in a differant manner than one with any other employee would be handled and firing me solely on a polygraph. I might mention the two questions took 2 hours due the the operators inexperience and the computor messing up.
    Last edited by rjwalker; 11-22-2006, 01:51 PM. Reason: typo

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  • ElleMD
    replied
    I agree that we dont' have the full story and probably never will but it is not necessary that there be an actual law that prohibits one from bringing a firearm into a school for the rule to be enforced.

    Leave a comment:


  • stiffnecked
    replied
    I don't mean to be brash but it is relevant. If he was teaching a DARE or SAVE
    class as part of his regular "ON-DUTY" assignment he should have had his firearm on his person. There is not any Alaska Statute that prohibits him from bringing his firearm into a school while he is on-duty, plain clothed or uniformed. However, if he chose, for personal reasons to leave it in his vehicle, and he was required to respond to calls outside of the school, there could be a problem.

    If his department requires that he answer all calls for assistance, fully equiped and prepared, and it's a matter of written policy, then he could have problems.

    Unfortunately, I think we are missing part of the story.

    Leave a comment:


  • ElleMD
    replied
    I don't work in Alaska but I do work in education. It is not unusual for an off duty law enforcement officer to be prohibited from bringing a weapon of any kind into a school. Those on duty as a general rule are permitted as it is part of their uniform and their job at the time. For instance, a police officer who responds to a call at a school certainly may bring his weapon with him. A parent coming in after work who happens to be a police officer would be asked to remove the weapon. If the OP was teaching a class, first of all I'm not sure why he left to respond to a call, but secondly, why he did or did not have his weapon on him is irrelevant.


    If the citizen accused you of not having your gun and you admit to not having it, why bother with a polygraph? Did you claim you had it on you and are now looking for a way out of trouble for lying? That is how the story sounds.

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  • stiffnecked
    replied
    I'm familiar with most of the PD's in southeast Alaska. Is your department represented by PSEA? Without contract protections your kind of at the whim of the employer. However, if your are a permanent employee you may have certain rights under your cities personnel policies.

    I'm curious as to why you couldn't have your firearm with you? Is that some kind of school district policy? That just doesn't make sense. I know a few other officers that teach DARE classes or work as school resource officers in other parts of Alaska and they all perform their duties in uniform, armed and in the school.

    You might want to consult an employment attorney in Anchorage. For what it's worth Alaska is a very pro-employee state.

    Leave a comment:


  • ArmyRetCW3
    replied
    The Employee Polygraph Protection Act (EPPA) applies to most private employers. The law does not cover federal, state, and local governments.

    http://dol.gov/compliance/guide/eppa.htm

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  • cbg
    replied
    My understanding is that employees of State and Federal government are not covered under the EPPA; therefore, it is legal to require a polygraph.

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  • demartian
    replied
    Originally posted by rjwalker View Post
    My question is, what are the circumstances, under the labor laws may warrant a polygraph in a State Agency (Law Enforcement) for an employee to have to be required to take one. I cannot believe it would be legal for the employer to request a polygraph based on a complaint filed by a citizen concerning wheather I had my gun on me or not. I did not commet a crime or internal policy.

    rick
    I think the laws relating to polygraphs are the possibility that a polygraph could be wrong. They could use one but wouldn't be able to base charges or actions based on one without the possibility of the other party disputing its accuracy.

    You state that you didn't have your gun on you. Did you tell them that was correct and that you couldn't have your gun because of being in a school? If it wasn't against policy to not have a gun, then telling the truth should have been ok.

    Leave a comment:

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