Let's take a moment and sympathize with Israelis:

-Their grand-grand-grand parents were tortured.
(so what? Armenians, Vietnamese, Kurds, Indians, Communists, Africans
have all been tortured. That's history, don't bring it her today)
-They are hated by everybody
(that's true, I have to agree with that one)
-They are a minority
(See, a small country in a wide see of hatred. And they hope to survive
with violence as their only way out. But by building hatred they are
destroying their existence. I am half-jew myself, and my grandmother was
well treated in an arab world, but today, there is no chance, because of the
bad image ISRAEL has given to JEWS)
-They have to face anti-semitism everyday
( actually, this is just a propaganda made by Israel. There is more
anti-semitism against arabs than there is against jews)
-They are full of fear
(more to come in the future of course - unless they embrace peace and
learn that a minority cannot keep ruling the world forever)

Israel you make jews ashamed !!!!!

Chas wrote:
Israel you make jews ashamed !!!!! You guys embarrass all human history.


Thank you for admitting that we ARE the human side.




mike

In article <GPVdc.32053$J56.4425@edtnps89>, ohmworkLEOPARD@spots.ca
says...
~Chas wrote:
~
~>>Israel you make jews ashamed !!!!!
~>
~>
~> You guys embarrass all human history.
~
~
~Thank you for admitting that we ARE the human side.
~
~mike

Another Michael I see. ;-)

--
Eugene Tooms
He gets into rooms

Israel you make jews ashamed !!!!!

Hi Anwar

That was a good post but I have learned from bitter experienc
that is very difficult to have a rational dialogue people obsessed
with their cult. Zionism has all the features of a cult.

These cults are doomed like Jim Jones cult.

The sooner this cult dies the better it for the non-Zionists on this
planet earth.

Farouk Dindar

Hi,

That is somehow true that it is hard to reason with Zionists.
But we have to fight at all levels.

The main problem is that this cult has managed to convince others that
they have good intentions. We have to keep reasoning so that others stop
being fooled by their ways.

Among muslims it is important to understand the difference between
zionists and jews. Some jews are fighting through art and intellect against
the state of Israel which existence is the largest organise scam in world
history. These jews are badly regarded by the media as "leftist" or
"communists". They use buzz-words to protect their
criminal-terrorist-racist existence.

Let's all do our best to win the war, we are learning zionist cunning
skills, and when we master them, we can fight them with their own weapons.

catch you later,
anwar


"Farouk Dindar" <remove_fdindar@attglobal.net> wrote in message
news:Z6Wdc.43215$wq4.2603093@news20.bellglobal.com ...Israel you make jews ashamed !!!!! Hi Anwar That was a good post but I have learned from bitter experienc that is very difficult to have a rational dialogue people obsessed with their cult. Zionism has all the features of a cult. These cults are doomed like Jim Jones cult. The sooner this cult dies the better it for the non-Zionists on this planet earth. Farouk Dindar

"anwar" <anwar.moukaddem@sympatico.ca> wrote You uneducated fool. While hitler killed the Jews, arabs protected
them. Keep that in mind.

The Arabs were allied with the Nazi's- that's how they lost Israel.
Don't even try to make any anologies here. If you want to make any anologies, look at all the massacres Israel is doing every
day.

Why has not the arab world taken it's brothers back into TransJordan? Why do
they not send humanitarian aid to the refugee camps and ease their
suffering? Why do they continue to use those poor TransJordanian colonists
as pawns in their game of Empire?
I have nothing agains jews, I am half jew myself. You are a human disgrace.

You probably should thank my God that I'm not in charge- your's ain't
helping much.
Human history? Come on !!! Who embarasses human history, the muslims
who are trying to struggle with empoverishment and weapons spread by americans to quench their sadistic thirst?

Cheerfully murdering those that they don't value enough to enslave;
despoiling holy artifacts and sites of every religion but their own;
financing the decadence of their princes by living in 7th century mud huts?
Or Americans who attack foreign countries to search for gold?

You mean the only market for that black stuff that used to kill your goats
if it polluted what little water is in your desert? The guys who could get
value out of a hole in the ground, and built hospitals, schools, water
purification plants and enriched your princes in exchange?
You mean nasty ol' America, where your children come to be medically
treated, educated and from whence they refuse to return home?
The only place in the world where Muslims enjoy more freedom to worship as
they choose than any muslim country in the entire world?
You are a disgrace to humanity. Ask the billion people who marched in
the streets of the world protesting your savage terrorist behaviour

Told you the Muslim world was united- it was probably closer to that 1.2B,
unless some were home sick, or taking flying lessons.

Chas

"anwar" <anwar.moukaddem@sympatico.ca> wrote Let's all do our best to win the war, we are learning zionist cunning skills,

geez, guys; it's been thirteen hundred years since Mohammed murdered the 600
and sold their families into slavery- you should be up to speed by now.
and when we master them,

Uh, yeah; as regards that thirteen hundred years- the Jews don't even have
any oil, partner- you can't even catch up carrying a bag of money to grease
your way.
Your big claim to fame is inventing the zero; how appropriate.
we can fight them with their own weapons.

Well, you certainly don't seem to be able to produce any of your ownduh- you
know, other than sending your best and brightest as bomb delivery systems,
single-use though they are.
I particularly liked the woman lawyer who managed to kill her own escort and
destroy the automobile they didn't allow her to drive. I figure that 72
virgins and a bunch of peg-boys is a fitting reward for her; an eternity of
bad lays and people who want to borrow her lipstick.

Chas

You just made my day, goats and milk, come on ... is this rational talk ?

The arabs protected the jews in the arab world. The Nazis by definition
are anti-semitists. Arabs are semitists.

Enough talking with you kiddy .... you have a long way to go. And watch,
watch closely as the American empire dissolves between your weak incompetent
hands ... God gave you something, you had the power to be just, but you
responded with treason. Beware cause God, our God, your God, will take
revenge.

As much as I scorn muslim islamists, I prefer them to a Nazi like you.



"Chas" <chasclementsSPOOF@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:bPOdnd3jEa_H2-XdRVn-ug@comcast.com... "anwar" <anwar.moukaddem@sympatico.ca> wrote You uneducated fool. While hitler killed the Jews, arabs protected them. Keep that in mind. The Arabs were allied with the Nazi's- that's how they lost Israel. Don't even try to make any anologies here. If you want to make any anologies, look at all the massacres Israel is doing every day. Why has not the arab world taken it's brothers back into TransJordan?
Why do they not send humanitarian aid to the refugee camps and ease their suffering? Why do they continue to use those poor TransJordanian
colonists as pawns in their game of Empire? I have nothing agains jews, I am half jew myself. You are a human disgrace. You probably should thank my God that I'm not in charge- your's ain't helping much. Human history? Come on !!! Who embarasses human history, the
muslims who are trying to struggle with empoverishment and weapons spread by
americans to quench their sadistic thirst? Cheerfully murdering those that they don't value enough to enslave; despoiling holy artifacts and sites of every religion but their own; financing the decadence of their princes by living in 7th century mud
huts? Or Americans who attack foreign countries to search for gold? You mean the only market for that black stuff that used to kill your
goats if it polluted what little water is in your desert? The guys who could
get value out of a hole in the ground, and built hospitals, schools, water purification plants and enriched your princes in exchange? You mean nasty ol' America, where your children come to be medically treated, educated and from whence they refuse to return home? The only place in the world where Muslims enjoy more freedom to worship
as they choose than any muslim country in the entire world? You are a disgrace to humanity. Ask the billion people who marched
in the streets of the world protesting your savage terrorist behaviour Told you the Muslim world was united- it was probably closer to that
1.2B, unless some were home sick, or taking flying lessons. Chas

geez, guys; it's been thirteen hundred years since Mohammed murdered the 600and sold their families into slavery- you should be up to speed by now.

This is typical style of the Zionist cult member

They will refer to some very remote event in history to justify their
crimes TODAY!

I find that in Canada suddenly on TV and newsmedia there are
aricles appearing on the Holocaust victims. As much as I sympathize
with the timing appears to be deflect from the crimes of the Zionists
in the occupied territiories.

The assasination of Yassin is something that has hit a sensitive spot
in EVERY Muslim and every decent human being on this earth.

The glee from the Zionist at seeing Yassins open skull with the brain
sticking out needs to be seen on the TV before passing judgement on
of Arabs in Falluja.

The Zionist are stupid and self deafeatist.

Their crimes may make bring on another silent " Holocaust" where
all Jewish people may not only have to change their
names but give up their religion to hide their identity

Farouk Dindar

Farouk Dindar

"Farouk Dindar" <remove_fdindar@attglobal.net> wrote in message
news:93Ydc.43282$wq4.2650393@news20.bellglobal.com ...geez, guys; it's been thirteen hundred years since Mohammed murdered the
600and sold their families into slavery- you should be up to speed by now. This is typical style of the Zionist cult member They will refer to some very remote event in history to justify their crimes TODAY! I find that in Canada suddenly on TV and newsmedia there are aricles appearing on the Holocaust victims. As much as I sympathize with the timing appears to be deflect from the crimes of the Zionists in the occupied territiories. The assasination of Yassin is something that has hit a sensitive spot in EVERY Muslim and every decent human being on this earth. The glee from the Zionist at seeing Yassins open skull with the brain sticking out needs to be seen on the TV before passing judgement on of Arabs in Falluja. The Zionist are stupid and self deafeatist. Their crimes may make bring on another silent " Holocaust" where all Jewish people may not only have to change their names but give up their religion to hide their identity Farouk Dindar

Good post, couldn't agree more !

"If I'd have wanted to die for Israel, I'd have joined the South Lebanon
Army."
- British Army Private, Iraq, July 2003

http://www.bnp.org.uk
http://www.bnp.org.uk/policies.html
http://www.bnp.org.uk/meet.html
http://www.bnp.org.uk/policy/policy_forum.htm
http://www.bnp.org.uk/faq.html
http://www.boycottisrael.org/Is_goods.htm
http://www.boycottusa.org/usa_goods.htm

"anwar" <anwar.moukaddem@sympatico.ca> wrote The arabs protected the jews in the arab world. The Nazis by
definition are anti-semitists. Arabs are semitists.

Just shows you how gullible the Nazi's found you to be.
As much as I scorn muslim islamists, I prefer them to a Nazi like you.

So you scorn the Words of the Prophet as well?

Chas

"Farouk Dindar" <remove_fdindar@attglobal.net> wrotegeez, guys; it's been thirteen hundred years since Mohammed murdered the
600and sold their families into slavery- you should be up to speed by now. This is typical style of the Zionist cult member They will refer to some very remote event in history to justify their crimes TODAY!

You mean like Mohammeds single miracle; the Single-Night's Journey to
Jerusalem?
Or just marking that event as the start of a history of unalloyed aggression
every day since then?
I find that in Canada suddenly on TV and newsmedia there are aricles appearing on the Holocaust victims. As much as I sympathize with the timing appears to be deflect from the crimes of the Zionists in the occupied territiories.

Seeing as you lot lost the war, and with it any claim on anything we didn't
care to take from you, stories of the Holocaust are about moot for you in
any case.
The assasination of Yassin is something that has hit a sensitive spot in EVERY Muslim and every decent human being on this earth.

cool.
Care to pick up his mantle?
The glee from the Zionist at seeing Yassins open skull with the brain sticking out needs to be seen on the TV before passing judgement on of Arabs in Falluja.

No ****- I think you guys underestimate how pissed those guys are. It won't
be long until they're actually fighting back instead of just doing garrison
duty.
The Zionist are stupid and self deafeatist.

And have the good land and pretty women.
Must really grump you guys living on a hot rock with a peg-boy.
Their crimes may make bring on another silent " Holocaust" where all Jewish people may not only have to change their names but give up their religion to hide their identity

Or just sending you clowns back to the stone age and letting you hate people
in the dark while hiding in a cave, eating your camel.
Cheer up; when we kick your ***, we usually send boatloads of Spam so you
won't starve- if history be our guide.
Bon appetit

Chas

"Farouk Dindar" <remove_fdindar@attglobal.net> wrote in message
news:93Ydc.43282$wq4.2650393@news20.bellglobal.com ...geez, guys; it's been thirteen hundred years since Mohammed murdered the
600and sold their families into slavery- you should be up to speed by now. This is typical style of the Zionist cult member They will refer to some very remote event in history to justify their crimes TODAY! I find that in Canada suddenly on TV and newsmedia there are aricles appearing on the Holocaust victims. As much as I sympathize with the timing appears to be deflect from the crimes of the Zionists in the occupied territiories. The assasination of Yassin is something that has hit a sensitive spot in EVERY Muslim and every decent human being on this earth. The glee from the Zionist at seeing Yassins open skull with the brain sticking out needs to be seen on the TV before passing judgement on of Arabs in Falluja.

As opposed to the glee from the Palestinians over 3000 people being killed
in the WTC and the Pentagon when a bunch of brainwashed Islamofascists
decided to fly airplanes into those buildings?

The three thousand who died there, as well as the hundreds who died in
Israeli restaurants and busses were not responsible for the deaths of
anyone.

You can't say that about any Islamofascist, including your hero, Yassin the
Assassin.

The Islamofascists have sealed their own fate. The Zionist are stupid and self deafeatist.

Self defeatist? Seems to me that continuing to inflict more suffering on
the Israelis only results in more Palestinian deaths. Seems pretty damned
self-defeatest to me.
Their crimes may make bring on another silent " Holocaust" where all Jewish people may not only have to change their names but give up their religion to hide their identity

Yeah, you would love that, especially if they all "convert" to Islam in
order to "hide their identity."
Farouk Dindar Farouk Dindar

Chas wrote:
The Arabs were allied with the Nazi's- that's how they lost Israel.

What a crock of sh*t.

The Arabs 'lost' nothing. It was stolen by the Balfour declaration in
1917. It was imposed on the Middle East by the zionists in the
government of England, among others.
==============================================

http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/mod/balfour.html



Foreign Office
November 2nd, 1917

Dear Lord Rothschild:

I have much pleasure in conveying to you. on behalf of His Majesty's
Government, the following declaration of sympathy with Jewish Zionist
aspirations which has been submitted to, and approved by, the Cabinet:

His Majesty's Government view with favor the establishment in Palestine
of a national home for the Jewish people, and will use their best
endeavors to facilitate the achievement of this object, it being clearly
understood that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and
religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the
rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country.

I should be grateful if you would bring this declaration to the knowledge
of the Zionist Federation.

Yours,
Arthur James Balfour

"m II" <ohmworkLEOPARD@spots.ca> wrote The Arabs were allied with the Nazi's- that's how they lost Israel. The Arabs 'lost' nothing. It was stolen by the Balfour declaration in 1917. It was imposed on the Middle East by the zionists in the government of England, among others.

and none of it stuck until after WWII.
Of course, if you want to go back in time, the muslims were poor thirds to
the Jews and Christians in the area, came at the point of a sword, and we've
been unable to dislodge them since.

Chas

"Farouk Dindar" <remove_fdindar@attglobal.net> wrote in message
news:93Ydc.43282$wq4.2650393@news20.bellglobal.com ...geez, guys; it's been thirteen hundred years since Mohammed murdered the
600and sold their families into slavery- you should be up to speed by now. This is typical style of the Zionist cult member They will refer to some very remote event in history to justify their crimes TODAY! I find that in Canada suddenly on TV and newsmedia there are aricles appearing on the Holocaust victims. As much as I sympathize with the timing appears to be deflect from the crimes of the Zionists in the occupied territiories. The assasination of Yassin is something that has hit a sensitive spot in EVERY Muslim and every decent human being on this earth. The glee from the Zionist at seeing Yassins open skull with the brain sticking out needs to be seen on the TV before passing judgement on of Arabs in Falluja.

As opposed to the glee from the Palestinians over 3000 people being killed
in the WTC and the Pentagon when a bunch of brainwashed Islamofascists
decided to fly airplanes into those buildings?

The three thousand who died there, as well as the hundreds who died in
Israeli restaurants and busses were not responsible for the deaths of
anyone.

You can't say that about any Islamofascist, including your hero, Yassin the
Assassin.

The Islamofascists have sealed their own fate.
The Zionist are stupid and self deafeatist.

Self defeatist? Seems to me that continuing to inflict more suffering on
the Israelis only results in more Palestinian deaths. Seems pretty damned
self-defeatest to me.
Their crimes may make bring on another silent " Holocaust" where all Jewish people may not only have to change their names but give up their religion to hide their identity

Yeah, you would love that, especially if they all "convert" to Islam in
order to "hide their identity."
Farouk Dindar Farouk Dindar

Chas wrote:

and none of it stuck until after WWII. Of course, if you want to go back in time, the muslims were poor thirds to the Jews and Christians in the area, came at the point of a sword, and we've been unable to dislodge them since.

There was a Christian Kingdom of Jerusalem before 600 AD. Then the
Crusades a few hundred years later. Remember those?

King Richard beheaded over two thousand Arab prisoners because the
ransom money to get their freedom was late and he didn't want to take
care of them at his own expense.

Richard then proceeds to get kidnapped himself in Germany while on his
way home.

The Kurds and the Arabs were getting bombed to hell by the English in
the early part of this century, circa 1920.

The Arabs seem to have been getting screwed over more often than not.
The theft of land by the European Jews was just another version of a
Crusade.

Dislodge them? It's their rightful land.



mike

"m II" <ohmworkLEOPARD@spots.ca> wrote There was a Christian Kingdom of Jerusalem before 600 AD. Then the Crusades a few hundred years later. Remember those?

Yes; to dislodge the muslim invaders who desecrate holy sites of other
religions, and restrict their right to worship as they please.
King Richard beheaded over two thousand Arab prisoners because the ransom money to get their freedom was late and he didn't want to take care of them at his own expense.

Yeah; and he was kinda grumpy about the children and religious' of the first
few Crusades- which weren't even military operations- being enslaved and
killed by the muslim invaders.
The Arabs seem to have been getting screwed over more often than not. The theft of land by the European Jews was just another version of a Crusade.

Good.
Dislodge them? It's their rightful land.

Hogwash; latecoming thieves with no rights or justification except that any
land muslims want is automatically theirs by the precepts of their religion.

Chas

anwar wrote: Let's take a moment and sympathize with Israelis: -Their grand-grand-grand parents were tortured. (so what? Armenians, Vietnamese, Kurds, Indians, Communists, Africans have all been tortured. That's history, don't bring it her today)

Tragically, what has been a fantastic survival strategy has also made
them a target for others' emnity. Even Qaddafi suggests that Arabs and
Muslims should emulate them, in the sense that they should strive to be
the most productive members of whatever society they are in.
-They are hated by everybody (that's true, I have to agree with that one)

Personally, I much prefer their company to that of vicious born-again
Christians -- of which there is no shortage. Unfortunately, Christians
and Muslims belong to expansionist religions, which have been known to
advance their peculiar superstitions by way of knife and sword.

What Islam needs to do is what Christianity recently underwent: a
sort of reformation. Even the Catholics in this country tell the Pope
where to go, because the Christian religion is frankly not worth
embracing in its entirety. Granted, we DO have our Osama-class nutters,
but they are generally kept under wraps.
-They are a minority (See, a small country in a wide see of hatred. And they hope to survive with violence as their only way out. But by building hatred they are destroying their existence. I am half-jew myself, and my grandmother was well treated in an arab world, but today, there is no chance, because of the bad image ISRAEL has given to JEWS)

Israel does seem to have become a flash-point. But if you think
Shrub was a lousy idea, you'd be better served to put down your RPGs for
a few months, and let us focus on our election and moribund economy. If
Shrub has to run on his disastrous economic policies, he loses. Period.
-They have to face anti-semitism everyday ( actually, this is just a propaganda made by Israel.

To some (e.g., American radio talk show host Dennis Prager), opposing
the existence of the Jewish state is anti-Semitism (whilst conveniently
forgetting that the ones complaining the loudest ARE Semites).
There is more anti-semitism against arabs than there is against jews) -They are full of fear (more to come in the future of course - unless they embrace peace and learn that a minority cannot keep ruling the world forever) Israel you make jews ashamed !!!!!

There seem to be a fair minority of Jews who don't see the need for
an Israel, particularly if it is acquired through unseemly means. As I
see it, it might make sense for them to start over in Long Island. We
would gain over two million of the most productive and motivated people
on the planet. Arabs would be able to recognize Israel from six
thousand miles away. And the only real losers would be the people of
Long Island, who would have their property taken from them without
compensation.

Do you think they'd be more magnanimous about it than the indigenous
Palestinians were in Israel? I wonder....

On Sun, 11 Apr 2004 10:25:35 GMT, Ken Smith <forget@it.com> wrote:
There seem to be a fair minority of Jews who don't see the need foran Israel, particularly if it is acquired through unseemly means. As Isee it, it might make sense for them to start over in Long Island.

Why not Colorado?

"Finis MacGuiness" <fmac@snickers.com> wrote in message
news:mtii70tlojbdk1va898evou29f8nuuuekd@4ax.com... On Sun, 11 Apr 2004 10:25:35 GMT, Ken Smith <forget@it.com> wrote: There seem to be a fair minority of Jews who don't see the need foran Israel, particularly if it is acquired through unseemly means. As Isee it, it might make sense for them to start over in Long Island. Why not Colorado?

Someplace in Africa was originally considered, then they discovered that
land was cheap west of the Dead Sea so they went with the historical area.

"anwar" <anwar.moukaddem@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:PQUdc.43165$wq4.2571963@news20.bellglobal.com ... Let's take a moment and sympathize with Israelis: -Their grand-grand-grand parents were tortured. (so what? Armenians, Vietnamese, Kurds, Indians, Communists,
Africans have all been tortured. That's history, don't bring it her today) -They are hated by everybody (that's true, I have to agree with that one) -They are a minority (See, a small country in a wide see of hatred. And they hope to
survive with violence as their only way out. But by building hatred they
are destroying their existence. I am half-jew myself, and my
grandmother was well treated in an arab world, but today, there is no chance,
because of the bad image ISRAEL has given to JEWS) -They have to face anti-semitism everyday ( actually, this is just a propaganda made by Israel. There is
more anti-semitism against arabs than there is against jews) -They are full of fear (more to come in the future of course - unless they embrace
peace and learn that a minority cannot keep ruling the world forever) Israel you make jews ashamed !!!!!

Yes, there are some, perhaps many, Jews who understand
that.

Unfortunately, none of them are the utterly evil and rapacious
"neo-con" Zionazis who control Bush and Blair.

That is where you need to make your attack - and I wish you
every good fortune with that difficult enterprise.

The cost of failure to bring them under control and to
neutralise their evil influence will, I fear, be far more
catastrophic for all Jews, some of whom do not deserve it,
than most currently foresee.

World communication is capable of being a great influence
for common understanding and good.

But what do you think the potential is for the next "holocaust"
becoming a global affair ?

"Chris X" <chris_X@postmaster.co.uk> wrote in message
news:OqydncQPGazayeXd4p2dnA@giganews.com... "Farouk Dindar" <remove_fdindar@attglobal.net> wrote in message news:93Ydc.43282$wq4.2650393@news20.bellglobal.com ...geez, guys; it's been thirteen hundred years since Mohammed
murdered the 600and sold their families into slavery- you should be up to speed
by now. This is typical style of the Zionist cult member They will refer to some very remote event in history to justify
their crimes TODAY! I find that in Canada suddenly on TV and newsmedia there are aricles appearing on the Holocaust victims. As much as I
sympathize with the timing appears to be deflect from the crimes of the
Zionists in the occupied territiories. The assasination of Yassin is something that has hit a sensitive
spot in EVERY Muslim and every decent human being on this earth. The glee from the Zionist at seeing Yassins open skull with the
brain sticking out needs to be seen on the TV before passing judgement
on of Arabs in Falluja. The Zionist are stupid and self deafeatist. Their crimes may make bring on another silent " Holocaust" where all Jewish people may not only have to change their names but give up their religion to hide their identity Farouk Dindar Good post, couldn't agree more !

And I will second that.

Especially the sentence "The Zionists are stupid and self
defeatist". Their blinding stupidity, obvious moral and
intellectual inferiority, incompetence, arrogance and
infamous corruption makes them unfit to be in charge of
anything.

The fact that they have managed to steal, cheat and
blackmail their way to be in charge of three of most
powerful nations in the western world (Britain, Canada
and the USA) leads me to suspect that the next "holocaust"
(and they have happened every 20 years over the last
1000 years, in one form or another) will be a global affair
- and not particularly silent.

And, as is the way of the world, the innocent Jews will
suffer along with the guilty.

"LawsonE" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:G3cec.5459$A_4.4345@newsread1.news.pas.earthl ink.net... "Finis MacGuiness" <fmac@snickers.com> wrote in message news:mtii70tlojbdk1va898evou29f8nuuuekd@4ax.com... On Sun, 11 Apr 2004 10:25:35 GMT, Ken Smith <forget@it.com> wrote: There seem to be a fair minority of Jews who don't see the need
foran Israel, particularly if it is acquired through unseemly means.
As Isee it, it might make sense for them to start over in Long
Island. Why not Colorado? Someplace in Africa was originally considered, then they discovered
that land was cheap west of the Dead Sea so they went with the historical
area.

I think Hitler had a plan to move them to Madagascar, off the
African coast, where they could be isolated from the rest of
humanity.

"anwar" <anwar.moukaddem@sympatico.ca> wrote in message news:<PQUdc.43165$wq4.2571963@news20.bellglobal.com>... Let's take a moment and sympathize with Israelis: -Their grand-grand-grand parents were tortured. (so what? Armenians, Vietnamese, Kurds, Indians, Communists, Africans have all been tortured. That's history, don't bring it her today)<

THey were enslaved over 3,000 years ago, according to their
historiography,
and were attacked and exiled from their land twice. They were one of
the
first minority groups in the world, often confined in ghettos. The
Holocaust
was only the last of many extreme massacres in which 1/3rd of the
Jewish
nation was exterpated. As bad as their respective holocausts were,
neither
the Armenians, Kurds, Indians, Communists, Africans or anyone else,
with
the possible exception of the Indians of the Americas, lost 1/3rd
their
population in a single calculated massacre. While blacks and others
have
been in diaspora for over 500 years, Jews were in diaspora for nearly
2,000. So Jews are the most experienced (unfortunately) minority in
history.
-They are hated by everybody (that's true, I have to agree with that one)<

Yes, almost everyone, that is true. And if the true Jews Jesus were
seen
today with his Jewish face, he'd be just as hated. But he's always
portrayed
as a blonde European, so how can such a cute face be hated?
-They are a minority (See, a small country in a wide see of hatred. And they hope to survive with violence as their only way out.<

Not the only way, but one of many ways. Why not? Everyone else uses
it?
But by building hatred they are destroying their existence. I am half-jew myself,<

Not necessarily. ANyway, there is no such thing as "half-Jew." I your
mother
was Jewish, you're Jewish. If she wasn't, you're not. Period. Doesn't
matter
if your father was Moses.
and my grandmother was well treated in an arab world, but today, there is no chance, because of the bad image ISRAEL has given to JEWS)<

Tough **** on the Arabs. They don't worry about their image, so why
should
Jews worry about ours? As you say, we're hated either way, so why not
live
up to it? We don't want to be hated for NOTHING. At least if we
finally
massacre our enemies there'll be a decent reason to hate us.
-They have to face anti-semitism everyday ( actually, this is just a propaganda made by Israel. There is more anti-semitism against arabs than there is against jews)<

IF there is, it is because Arabs don't try to have a good image. They
openly call for ISlamization of the world, use of terror, civilian
hostages,
shooting from mosques and hospitals, using their own children as
bombs, etc.
And then you still want a good image too? We Jews have to learn from
you
Arabs PR. The UN always backs YOU, not us. Just shows you, that
barbarism
works in this world.
-They are full of fear (more to come in the future of course - unless they embrace peace and learn that a minority cannot keep ruling the world forever)<

We'll continue to rule the world as long as we want, or as long as
Allah
allows us. So bend down and kiss my ***, Musselman :) My *** is your
Qibla :)
Israel you make jews ashamed !!!!!<

ONly those who hate themselves to begin with. THere is nothing Israel
can do
that can make self-hating Jews love themselves. Only extraordinarily
expert plastic surgeons can accomplish that :)

"anwar" <anwar.moukaddem@sympatico.ca> wrote in message news:<PQUdc.43165$wq4.2571963@news20.bellglobal.com>... Let's take a moment and sympathize with Israelis: -Their grand-grand-grand parents were tortured. (so what? Armenians, Vietnamese, Kurds, Indians, Communists, Africans have all been tortured. That's history, don't bring it her today)<

THey were enslaved over 3,000 years ago, according to their
historiography,
and were attacked and exiled from their land twice. They were one of
the
first minority groups in the world, often confined in ghettos. The
Holocaust
was only the last of many extreme massacres in which 1/3rd of the
Jewish
nation was exterpated. As bad as their respective holocausts were,
neither
the Armenians, Kurds, Indians, Communists, Africans or anyone else,
with
the possible exception of the Indians of the Americas, lost 1/3rd
their
population in a single calculated massacre. While blacks and others
have
been in diaspora for over 500 years, Jews were in diaspora for nearly
2,000. So Jews are the most experienced (unfortunately) minority in
history.
-They are hated by everybody (that's true, I have to agree with that one)<

Yes, almost everyone, that is true. And if the true Jews Jesus were
seen
today with his Jewish face, he'd be just as hated. But he's always
portrayed
as a blonde European, so how can such a cute face be hated?
-They are a minority (See, a small country in a wide see of hatred. And they hope to survive with violence as their only way out.<

Not the only way, but one of many ways. Why not? Everyone else uses
it?
But by building hatred they are destroying their existence. I am half-jew myself,<

Not necessarily. ANyway, there is no such thing as "half-Jew." I your
mother
was Jewish, you're Jewish. If she wasn't, you're not. Period. Doesn't
matter
if your father was Moses.
and my grandmother was well treated in an arab world, but today, there is no chance, because of the bad image ISRAEL has given to JEWS)<

Tough **** on the Arabs. They don't worry about their image, so why
should
Jews worry about ours? As you say, we're hated either way, so why not
live
up to it? We don't want to be hated for NOTHING. At least if we
finally
massacre our enemies there'll be a decent reason to hate us.
-They have to face anti-semitism everyday ( actually, this is just a propaganda made by Israel. There is more anti-semitism against arabs than there is against jews)<

IF there is, it is because Arabs don't try to have a good image. They
openly call for ISlamization of the world, use of terror, civilian
hostages,
shooting from mosques and hospitals, using their own children as
bombs, etc.
And then you still want a good image too? We Jews have to learn from
you
Arabs PR. The UN always backs YOU, not us. Just shows you, that
barbarism
works in this world.
-They are full of fear (more to come in the future of course - unless they embrace peace and learn that a minority cannot keep ruling the world forever)<

We'll continue to rule the world as long as we want, or as long as
Allah
allows us. So bend down and kiss my ***, Musselman :) My *** is your
Qibla :)
Israel you make jews ashamed !!!!!<

ONly those who hate themselves to begin with. THere is nothing Israel
can do
that can make self-hating Jews love themselves. Only extraordinarily
expert plastic surgeons can accomplish that :)

> The Arabs seem to have been getting screwed over more often than not. The theft of land by the European Jews was just another version of a Crusade. Good. Dislodge them? It's their rightful land. Hogwash; latecoming thieves with no rights or justification except that any land muslims want is automatically theirs by the precepts of their religion.

Interesting... who is latecoming here? Jews or Arabs? let's see when
all those arab countries and Israel became independent (Source: CIA
world fact book)

Iraq:
Iraq attained its independence as a kingdom in 1932

Jordan:
The British protectorate of Trans-Jordan became independent in 1946
and in 1949 was remaned into Jordan

Saudi Arabia:
Nedjed annexed Nedjed and Asir and became independent in 1927 as
Hedshas-Nedjed. The country was renamed into Saudi-Arabia in 1932

Yemen:
North Yemen became independent of the Ottoman Empire in 1918
South Yemen became independent in 1967

Egypt:
Egypt Independence Granted by the United Kingdom February 28, 1922

Lebanon:
The country gained independence in 1943 by French

Syria:
January 1, 1944

Israel:
On May 14, 1948, the State of Israel was proclaimed by United Kingdom
and UN Plan. Jews began moving to the Turkish and later British
controlled region: the British mandate of Palestine, resulting in
their rise from 11% of the population in 1922 to 30% by 1940.


hmmm..... Israel was late by 4 full years!!!! common guys, stop with
this BS propaganda that all Arabs were there living since generations
in peace before the bad Israelis came and took away their land! After
the WW II we had around 100 Mio refugees worldwide. World's task back
then was to bring everyone back to place, with UN as the central
organization. Most Arab countries were established or became
independent only after 1920s! this is not a matter of 1-2 days to
bring back order ! (in a matter of fact, this process is still not
over. see british mandate in korea/china etc that was removed only a
few years ago).

India pakistan same deal in 1950s, but they managed it better with the
refugee problem.

Conclusion: NOBODY IS LATE HERE!! not the Jews, Not the Arabs, not the
muslims, nobody is late. It's a process!

swissguy8@hotmail.com (the neutral) wrote in message news:<7e9dee49.0404111419.29b2ceda@posting.google.com>... The Arabs seem to have been getting screwed over more often than not. The theft of land by the European Jews was just another version of a Crusade. Good. Dislodge them? It's their rightful land. Hogwash; latecoming thieves with no rights or justification except that any land muslims want is automatically theirs by the precepts of their religion. Interesting... who is latecoming here? Jews or Arabs? let's see when all those arab countries and Israel became independent (Source: CIA world fact book) (circumcised)

It is the Palestine® - Israeli conflict the origin of which is the
desire of the largely immigrant bunch of neighbourhood arabs who were
drawn by the jooovish development projects to grab what wasn't theirs.
To cover such an unpleasant fact the palestinian® mythology was
compiled at the center of which lies a fairy-tale about the
"indigenous Palestinian people"®.
hmmm..... Israel was late by 4 full years!!!!

Kuwait was formed in 1962! Wow!

Wotan wrote: "Chris X" <chris_X@postmaster.co.uk> wrote in message news:OqydncQPGazayeXd4p2dnA@giganews.com..."Farouk Dindar" <remove_fdindar@attglobal.net> wrote in messagenews:93Ydc.43282$wq4.2650393@news20.bellglo bal.com...>geez, guys; it's been thirteen hundred years since Mohammed murdered the600>and sold their families into slavery- you should be up to speed by now.This is typical style of the Zionist cult memberThey will refer to some very remote event in history to justify theircrimes TODAY!I find that in Canada suddenly on TV and newsmedia there arearicles appearing on the Holocaust victims. As much as I sympathizewith the timing appears to be deflect from the crimes of the Zionistsin the occupied territiories.The assasination of Yassin is something that has hit a sensitive spotin EVERY Muslim and every decent human being on this earth.The glee from the Zionist at seeing Yassins open skull with the brainsticking out needs to be seen on the TV before passing judgement onof Arabs in Falluja. The Zionist are stupid and self deafeatist.Their crimes may make bring on another silent " Holocaust" where all Jewish people may not only have to change theirnames but give up their religion to hide their identityFarouk DindarGood post, couldn't agree more ! And I will second that. Especially the sentence "The Zionists are stupid and self defeatist". Their blinding stupidity, obvious moral and intellectual inferiority, incompetence, arrogance and infamous corruption makes them unfit to be in charge of anything. The fact that they have managed to steal, cheat and blackmail their way to be in charge of three of most powerful nations in the western world (Britain, Canada and the USA) leads me to suspect that the next "holocaust" (and they have happened every 20 years over the last 1000 years, in one form or another) will be a global affair - and not particularly silent. And, as is the way of the world, the innocent Jews will suffer along with the guilty.




So why is this taking so long to happen, then ?

Chas wrote:
"m II" <ohmworkLEOPARD@spots.ca> wroteThere was a Christian Kingdom of Jerusalem before 600 AD. Then theCrusades a few hundred years later. Remember those? Yes; to dislodge the muslim invaders who desecrate holy sites of other religions, and restrict their right to worship as they please.King Richard beheaded over two thousand Arab prisoners because theransom money to get their freedom was late and he didn't want to takecare of them at his own expense. Yeah; and he was kinda grumpy about the children and religious' of the first few Crusades- which weren't even military operations- being enslaved and killed by the muslim invaders.The Arabs seem to have been getting screwed over more often than not.The theft of land by the European Jews was just another version of aCrusade. Good.Dislodge them? It's their rightful land. Hogwash; latecoming thieves with no rights or justification except that any land muslims want is automatically theirs by the precepts of their religion. Chas


Bist du ein Jueden ?

Finis MacGuiness wrote: On Sun, 11 Apr 2004 10:25:35 GMT, Ken Smith <forget@it.com> wrote:
There seem to be a fair minority of Jews who don't see the need foran Israel, particularly if it is acquired through unseemly means. As Isee it, it might make sense for them to start over in Long Island. Why not Colorado?

Can't get a decent bagel here. We have to send out to New York. :)

You're missing my more subtle point: that the indigenous Palestinians
aren't happy at having their land stolen -- and the good people of Long
Island (by way of example) could hardly be expected to be better about
it....

You're missing my more subtle point: that the indigenous Palestiniansaren't happy at having their land stolen -- and the good people of LongIsland (by way of example) could hardly be expected to be better aboutit....

I agree.

If the Zionist cult promised its converts a Kingdom after death like
Jehovans witness there would not be major problem.

Farouk Dindar

"the neutral" <swissguy8@hotmail.com> wrote Interesting... who is latecoming here? Jews or Arabs? let's see when all those arab countries and Israel became independent

Israel; 4,000 years, and counting.
hmmm..... Israel was late by 4 full years!!!!

Even Christians have been there longer than muslims- who have no claim at
all to the Holy Land.
Conclusion: NOBODY IS LATE HERE!! not the Jews, Not the Arabs, not the muslims, nobody is late. It's a process!

Then abide by who won the wars, or start another one if you don't like how
the last ones turned out.

Chas

"Ed" <us8@nc.rr.com> wrote Bist du ein Jueden ?

nope; Welsh- God's other chosen people <g>
Additionally, I'm a longtime student of Islam, particularly as reflected in
Indonesian cultural artifacts.
My support of Israel is religious in nature; part of my cultural heritage as
well as that of the Jews.
Jews aren't the only Israelites, and Islam has been our hereditary enemy for
1300 years.

Chas

"Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote You're missing my more subtle point: that the indigenous Palestinians

You misspelled 'TransJordanian Colonists'.

Chas

"Farouk Dindar" <remove_fdindar@attglobal.net> wrote If the Zionist cult promised its converts a Kingdom after death like Jehovans witness there would not be major problem.

Hell; you guys live in refugee camps when you could be frolicking with the
72 virgins, all the little peg-boys, and the spirits of random civilians to
serve you.
What's up with that?

Chas

"Wotan" <Wotan@Valhalla.net> wrote in message news:<40796029@212.67.96.135>... "LawsonE" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message news:G3cec.5459$A_4.4345@newsread1.news.pas.earthl ink.net... "Finis MacGuiness" <fmac@snickers.com> wrote in message news:mtii70tlojbdk1va898evou29f8nuuuekd@4ax.com... On Sun, 11 Apr 2004 10:25:35 GMT, Ken Smith <forget@it.com> wrote: > There seem to be a fair minority of Jews who don't see the need for >an Israel, particularly if it is acquired through unseemly means. As I >see it, it might make sense for them to start over in Long Island. Why not Colorado? Someplace in Africa was originally considered, then they discovered that land was cheap west of the Dead Sea so they went with the historical area. I think Hitler had a plan to move them to Madagascar, off the African coast, where they could be isolated from the rest of humanity.

For you to cry about the "indigenous madagascarians" today like you
cry about nonexistent "indigenous palestinians"®? It would be much
better if you found a job and were useful to the international
community.

The post which was attributed to Ed is a forgery.


"Ed" <us8@nc.rr.com> wrote in message
news:S%pec.19661$Ll3.637118@twister.southeast.rr.c om... Chas wrote: "m II" <ohmworkLEOPARD@spots.ca> wroteThere was a Christian Kingdom of Jerusalem before 600 AD. Then theCrusades a few hundred years later. Remember those? Yes; to dislodge the muslim invaders who desecrate holy sites of other religions, and restrict their right to worship as they please.King Richard beheaded over two thousand Arab prisoners because theransom money to get their freedom was late and he didn't want to takecare of them at his own expense. Yeah; and he was kinda grumpy about the children and religious' of the
first few Crusades- which weren't even military operations- being enslaved and killed by the muslim invaders.The Arabs seem to have been getting screwed over more often than not.The theft of land by the European Jews was just another version of aCrusade. Good.Dislodge them? It's their rightful land. Hogwash; latecoming thieves with no rights or justification except that
any land muslims want is automatically theirs by the precepts of their
religion. Chas Bist du ein Jueden ?

"Chas" <chasclementsSPOOF@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:R7KdnV7RZMalDOfdRVn-hA@comcast.com... "the neutral" <swissguy8@hotmail.com> wrote Interesting... who is latecoming here? Jews or Arabs? let's see when all those arab countries and Israel became independent Israel; 4,000 years, and counting. hmmm..... Israel was late by 4 full years!!!! Even Christians have been there longer than muslims- who have no claim at all to the Holy Land. Conclusion: NOBODY IS LATE HERE!! not the Jews, Not the Arabs, not the muslims, nobody is late. It's a process! Then abide by who won the wars, or start another one if you don't like how the last ones turned out. Chas

Not that the Arabs "starting another war" would make any difference. Israel
would thrash them within a week.

"Chas" <chasclementsSPOOF@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:R7KdnV7RZMalDOfdRVn-hA@comcast.com... "the neutral" <swissguy8@hotmail.com> wrote Interesting... who is latecoming here? Jews or Arabs? let's see when all those arab countries and Israel became independent Israel; 4,000 years, and counting. hmmm..... Israel was late by 4 full years!!!! Even Christians have been there longer than muslims- who have no claim at all to the Holy Land. Conclusion: NOBODY IS LATE HERE!! not the Jews, Not the Arabs, not the muslims, nobody is late. It's a process! Then abide by who won the wars, or start another one if you don't like how the last ones turned out. Chas

As if the Arabs "starting another war" would make any difference. Israel
would have them whipped in less than a week.

"Ed" <us8@nc.rr.com> wrote in message
news:S%pec.19661$Ll3.637118@twister.southeast.rr.c om... Chas wrote: "m II" <ohmworkLEOPARD@spots.ca> wroteThere was a Christian Kingdom of Jerusalem before 600 AD. Then theCrusades a few hundred years later. Remember those? Yes; to dislodge the muslim invaders who desecrate holy sites of other religions, and restrict their right to worship as they please.King Richard beheaded over two thousand Arab prisoners because theransom money to get their freedom was late and he didn't want to takecare of them at his own expense. Yeah; and he was kinda grumpy about the children and religious' of the
first few Crusades- which weren't even military operations- being enslaved and killed by the muslim invaders.The Arabs seem to have been getting screwed over more often than not.The theft of land by the European Jews was just another version of aCrusade. Good.Dislodge them? It's their rightful land. Hogwash; latecoming thieves with no rights or justification except that
any land muslims want is automatically theirs by the precepts of their
religion. Chas Bist du ein Jueden ?


This posting is a forgery.

This post is a forgery.

"Ed" <us8@nc.rr.com> wrote in message
news:4Ypec.19659$Ll3.637118@twister.southeast.rr.c om... Wotan wrote: "Chris X" <chris_X@postmaster.co.uk> wrote in message news:OqydncQPGazayeXd4p2dnA@giganews.com..."Farouk Dindar" <remove_fdindar@attglobal.net> wrote in messagenews:93Ydc.43282$wq4.2650393@news20.bellglo bal.com...>>>geez, guys; it's been thirteen hundred years since Mohammed murdered the600>>and sold their families into slavery- you should be up to speed by now.>This is typical style of the Zionist cult member>>They will refer to some very remote event in history to justify their>crimes TODAY!>>I find that in Canada suddenly on TV and newsmedia there are>aricles appearing on the Holocaust victims. As much as I sympathize>with the timing appears to be deflect from the crimes of the Zionists>in the occupied territiories.>>The assasination of Yassin is something that has hit a sensitive spot>in EVERY Muslim and every decent human being on this earth.>>The glee from the Zionist at seeing Yassins open skull with the brain>sticking out needs to be seen on the TV before passing judgement on>of Arabs in Falluja.>> The Zionist are stupid and self deafeatist.>>Their crimes may make bring on another silent " Holocaust" where> all Jewish people may not only have to change their>names but give up their religion to hide their identity>>Farouk DindarGood post, couldn't agree more ! And I will second that. Especially the sentence "The Zionists are stupid and self defeatist". Their blinding stupidity, obvious moral and intellectual inferiority, incompetence, arrogance and infamous corruption makes them unfit to be in charge of anything. The fact that they have managed to steal, cheat and blackmail their way to be in charge of three of most powerful nations in the western world (Britain, Canada and the USA) leads me to suspect that the next "holocaust" (and they have happened every 20 years over the last 1000 years, in one form or another) will be a global affair - and not particularly silent. And, as is the way of the world, the innocent Jews will suffer along with the guilty. So why is this taking so long to happen, then ?

"Ed" <do-not-spam-me@go.away.spammer.com> wrote in message
news:5Y2dnbp9cdFFsubdRVn-jA@comcast.com... The post which was attributed to Ed is a forgery.

How can you tell, er..... Ed?

(Such a coincidence...... TWO Eds on Usenet.)


Bubba

Ken Smith wrote:
Finis MacGuiness wrote: Ken Smith wrote:
There seem to be a fair minority of Jews who don't see the need for an Israel, particularly if it is acquired through unseemly means.

What bollocks! (But then, what else should we expect from Ken Smith?)
As I see it, it might make sense for them to start over in Long Island.

Aren't they already there?
Why not Colorado?
Can't get a decent bagel here.

What would you know about decent bagels? Sure you can find a decent bagel in
Denver. You just have to know where to look. (But you're not going to find
them in the local King Soopers.
We have to send out to New York. :)

I've got news for you, there are some lousy bagels in New York, too.
You're missing my more subtle point: that the indigenous Palestinians

What "indegenous" Palestinians? There aren't hardly any of them.
aren't happy at having their land stolen

Oh, here's a nice one. Call the theives "victims", and call the victims
"thieves".
-- and the good people of Long Island (by way of example) could hardly be expected to be better about it ...

The United States, like Israel, have the necessary military hardware, thank
God, to defend what is rightfully theirs.
--
Theodore A. Kaldis
kaldis@worldnet.att.net

"BUBBA" <bitbucketbot@comcast,net> wrote in message
news:GcSdnSNN3czHo-bd4p2dnA@comcast.com... "Ed" <do-not-spam-me@go.away.spammer.com> wrote in message news:5Y2dnbp9cdFFsubdRVn-jA@comcast.com... The post which was attributed to Ed is a forgery. How can you tell, er..... Ed? (Such a coincidence...... TWO Eds on Usenet.) Bubba

Check the ISP addresses.

"Ed" <No_Spam@do_not_spam_me.net> wrote in message
news:p_WdnZNb2Ikh3-bd4p2dnA@comcast.com... The post which was attributed to Ed is a forgery. How can you tell, er..... Ed? (Such a coincidence...... TWO Eds on Usenet.) Bubba Check the ISP addresses.

So..... why are you forging Ed's handle?

Bubba

On Mon, 12 Apr 2004 20:13:00 -0400, "Ed" <nesord@comcast.net> wrote:
The post which was attributed to Ed is a forgery."Ed" <us8@nc.rr.com> wrote in messagenews:S%pec.19661$Ll3.637118@twister.southea st.rr.com... Chas wrote: "m II" <ohmworkLEOPARD@spots.ca> wrote>There was a Christian Kingdom of Jerusalem before 600 AD. Then the>Crusades a few hundred years later. Remember those? Yes; to dislodge the muslim invaders who desecrate holy sites of other religions, and restrict their right to worship as they please.>King Richard beheaded over two thousand Arab prisoners because the>ransom money to get their freedom was late and he didn't want to take>care of them at his own expense. Yeah; and he was kinda grumpy about the children and religious' of thefirst few Crusades- which weren't even military operations- being enslaved and killed by the muslim invaders.>The Arabs seem to have been getting screwed over more often than not.>The theft of land by the European Jews was just another version of a>Crusade. Good.>Dislodge them? It's their rightful land. Hogwash; latecoming thieves with no rights or justification except thatany land muslims want is automatically theirs by the precepts of theirreligion. Chas Bist du ein Jueden ?

You're the only Ed on Usenet, Rosenberg.
But the email addresses are different.
Of course it's a forgery. Duh.

Theodore A. Kaldis wrote: Ken Smith wrote:Finis MacGuiness wrote:Ken Smith wrote:

[snip]
You're missing my more subtle point: that the indigenous Palestinians What "indegenous" Palestinians? There aren't hardly any of them.

But their offspring are legion. They were living on the land, and
had every right to be there under British law. The Brits simply carved
them out of existence....
aren't happy at having their land stolen Oh, here's a nice one. Call the theives "victims", and call the victims "thieves".

It's precisely what you're doing. Israel agreed to either
restitution or repatriation; you can look it up. Pay the lady....

You know my solution: Pay the Palestinians a fair price for the land,
and use those funds and the considerable Israeli talents to develop the
Palestinian economy. Why couldn't the Gaza be a tourist mecca?

I don't see any end to that morass, unless we dare to think 'outside
the box'. And unless we understand and appreciate the core aspects of
the problem, we can't come up with a realistic solution....

One of my clients is going this summer. Personally, I'd prefer that
she didn't get shot at or blown up whilst visiting. I like my Jews in
one piece, drinking margs down at the Rio or busting moguls at Vail. :)
-- and the good people of Long Island (by way of example) could hardly beexpected to be better about it ... The United States, like Israel, have the necessary military hardware, thank God, to defend what is rightfully theirs.

And on what objective ground do *European* Jews have rightful title
to the land? They've been gone for centuries....

The challenge is in creating the conditions upon which Israel has the
permission to exist. That may never happen, but it's virtually certain
never to happen if the status quo continues.

Chas wrote: "Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote You're missing my more subtle point: that the indigenous Palestinians You misspelled 'TransJordanian Colonists'.

They were there. Ihe European Jews hadn't been there for millenia.

I don't claim a birthright to my ancestral home. Why should they?

Theodore A. Kaldis wrote: Ken Smith wrote:Finis MacGuiness wrote:Ken Smith wrote:>There seem to be a fair minority of Jews who don't see the need for an>Israel, particularly if it is acquired through unseemly means. What bollocks!

Try reading an Israeli newspaper for once in your life. Hell, try
reading anything....
(But then, what else should we expect from Ken Smith?)

Translated, Ted doesn't like my expression of these views, but can't
counter them by articulating a coherent objection. As such, he has to
attack me personally.
>As I see it, it might make sense for them to start over in Long Island. Aren't they already there?Why not Colorado?Can't get a decent bagel here. What would you know about decent bagels? Sure you can find a decent bagel in Denver. You just have to know where to look. (But you're not going to find them in the local King Soopers.

I defer to the *REAL* experts, Goy Boy!

baboon@mighty.co.za (Terence Fformby-Smythe) wrote in message news:<cec18032.0404120653.549a39f8@posting.google.com>... "Wotan" <Wotan@Valhalla.net> wrote in message news:<40796029@212.67.96.135>... "LawsonE" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message news:G3cec.5459$A_4.4345@newsread1.news.pas.earthl ink.net... "Finis MacGuiness" <fmac@snickers.com> wrote in message news:mtii70tlojbdk1va898evou29f8nuuuekd@4ax.com... > On Sun, 11 Apr 2004 10:25:35 GMT, Ken Smith <forget@it.com> wrote: > > > There seem to be a fair minority of Jews who don't see the need for > >an Israel, particularly if it is acquired through unseemly means. As I > >see it, it might make sense for them to start over in Long Island. > > Why not Colorado? Someplace in Africa was originally considered, then they discovered that land was cheap west of the Dead Sea so they went with the historical area. I think Hitler had a plan to move them to Madagascar, off the African coast, where they could be isolated from the rest of humanity. For you to cry about the "indigenous madagascarians" today like you cry about nonexistent "indigenous palestinians"®? It would be much better if you found a job and were useful to the international community.

rounding up stray camelz in haifa is a useful job
its the palistanian destiny
enjoy already
b'wahahahahahaha!!!

"Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote You misspelled 'TransJordanian Colonists'. They were there. Ihe European Jews hadn't been there for millenia.

They were brought in to colonize, deliberately. Moreover, they've been
abandoned and used as pawns since.
I don't claim a birthright to my ancestral home. Why should they?

Because they can?
Maybe they took a page from the Indian Book?

Chas

Ken Smith <forget@it.com> wrote in message news:<407B759C.8040704@it.com>... Chas wrote: "Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote You're missing my more subtle point: that the indigenous Palestinians You misspelled 'TransJordanian Colonists'. They were there. Ihe European Jews hadn't been there for millenia. I don't claim a birthright to my ancestral home. Why should they?

hey Ken, are seriously saying that the palestinians were living in the
middle east (where Israel is today) before Israel came? do you
seriously thing there was a palestinian civilization? if so, tell me
all about them, I still couldnt find any information on palestinians
BEFORE the late 1960s. Tell me about their people, about their
culture, some type of currency they had, who was their leader? what
did they built or have done in the past that they are proud of? what
was the border? from what civilization in the history do they come
from?
what was their feeling when the ottomans (the turks) took the land
from them.. and later what was their feeling when the british took the
land away from them? did they even fighted? or even tried to resist?
if so, how many died in the battle?

wake up you moron, these were jordanian refugees! and they are till
today not allowed to return to their homeland.. they have tried it
several times and there was even a major battle and killing among
these refugees and Jordan. (enter Black September in google to read on
that).. avoid jewish, islamic and nazi sites please.

Israel has minimum the same right to exist as the other arabic nations
started and became independent during the same time:


Iraq:
Iraq attained its independence as a kingdom in 1932

Jordan:
The British protectorate of Trans-Jordan became independent in 1946
and in 1949 was remaned into Jordan

Saudi Arabia:
Nedjed annexed Nedjed and Asir and became independent in 1927 as
Hedshas-Nedjed. The country was renamed into Saudi-Arabia in 1932

Yemen:
North Yemen became independent of the Ottoman Empire in 1918
South Yemen independent in 1967

Egypt:
Egypt Independence Granted by the United Kingdom
February 28, 1922

Lebanon:
The country gained independence in 1943 by French

Syria:
January 1, 1944

Israel:
Jews began moving to the Turkish and later British controlled region:
the British mandate of Palestine, resulting in their rise from 11% of
the population in 1922 to 30% by 1940. On May 14, 1948, the State of
Israel was proclaimed in territory given for the Jewish state in the
UN plan.


Kuwait: ca. 1960s became a nation

You can't escape the truth.. those 400,000 jordanian refugees back in
1948 have failed several times to return to their homeland Jordan
(nobody can't blaim them for that) and it was only in late 1967 where
they tried a final attempt to return to Jordan with force wich
resulted in major battle among the arabs, which is well documented in
the history as Black September 1970s. ONLY after that time those
refugees has started to claim Israel to be their homeland, NOT
BEFORE!!!! No Arab country cared about Jerusalem to be their capital,
cause Jerusalme has never really ment anything to the moslems.. this
is all arab propaganda... for your information: jews pray towards
jerusalem, cause it is their holy place or whatever... moslems pray
with their back towards jerusalem! cause Mekka is their holy place..
capiche? hope it went now in your brain that jews didnt steel the
land.

the issue today is far more important.. what should we do with the
then 400,000 Jordanian refugees that grown today to 5,5 mio in those
refugee camps? why should israel be responsible for that? Israel has
only 1/10th of 1 % of what Arab Countries have... so why should israel
play the babysitter here?

On Sat, 10 Apr 2004 13:16:23 -0400, "anwar"
<anwar.moukaddem@sympatico.ca> wrote:
While hitler killed the Jews, arabs protected them.

Like all those Jews Arabs murdered in Iraq in 1941 ?

"anwar" <anwar.moukaddem@sympatico.ca> wrote in message news:<GUXdc.43268$wq4.2647455@news20.bellglobal.com>...You just made my day, goats and milk, come on ... is this rational
talk ?The arabs protected the jews in the arab world.

How were Arabs "protecting" Jews when they massacred them in 1920,
1921, 1929, 1936, 1937, 1938, 1939, 1941, and on?
The Nazis by definition are anti-semitists. Arabs are semitists.

Arabs were cheering on the Nazis in 1935, when the editor of the
Arabic edition of the Palestine Post wrote that Germany and Italy were
"the only true democracies in the world today. Nazis began funding
Arabs in 1937. Arabs returned the favor by abetting the pro-Nazi
Rashid Ali coup, and creating the Hanjar SS to massacre Bosnian Xians
and Jews.

In July, the Mufti visited the local German counsel-general in
Jerusalem to declare his admiration for the new Germany, and to
solicit German friendship in return...In November and December,
Dr Said Abd al-Fattah al-Iman, president of the Arab Club of
Damascus, traveled to Berlin on behalf of the Mufti to seek
German financial and military help. These appeals did not go
unanswered.
[...]
Meanwhile, the Nazi propaganda apparatus in Palestine itself
was growing rapidly and was staffed by German shipping agents,
commercial travelers, and businessmen, as well as by diplomats
and permanent residents. [T]he director of the German news agency
in Palestine, Dr Franz Reichert, enjoyed cordial relations with the
Mufti.
[...]
When the Prophet Muhammad's birthday was celebrated in May
1937, German and Italian flags and photographs of Hitler and
Mussolini was carried prominently by Arab demonstrates in
Palestine, while Arab newspapers hailed this demonstration
as a "significant gesture of sympathy and respect with the
Nazis and Fascists in their trials at the hands of Jewish
intrigues and international financial pressure."
[...]
By mid-October, violence surpassing the level of the previous
year raged throughout Palestine, with attacks on Jewish
settlements and buses and the murder of Jewish civilians.
For the first time, British patrols were cut down, the new
airport at Lydda was burned, troop trains were derailed, and
the oil line from Mosul to Haifa was badly damaged.
- H.M. Sachar, A History of Israel (Vol 1), p 211
As much as I scorn muslim islamists, I prefer them to a Nazi like
you.

There's a difference?

Deborah

"BUBBA" <bitbucketbot@comcast,net> wrote in message
news:aqOdnc5HHtPd--bdRVn-iQ@comcast.com... "Ed" <No_Spam@do_not_spam_me.net> wrote in message news:p_WdnZNb2Ikh3-bd4p2dnA@comcast.com... > The post which was attributed to Ed is a forgery. > How can you tell, er..... Ed? (Such a coincidence...... TWO Eds on Usenet.) Bubba Check the ISP addresses. So..... why are you forging Ed's handle? Bubba

I am the original Ed, better ask the forger.

"Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote in message news:407B759C.8040704@it.com... Chas wrote: "Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote You're missing my more subtle point: that the indigenous Palestinians You misspelled 'TransJordanian Colonists'. They were there. Ihe European Jews hadn't been there for millenia. I don't claim a birthright to my ancestral home. Why should they?

The point is that if you WANTED to live in your ancestral home, wherever it
may be, you would be able to do so without fear of someone trying to kill
you.

the neutral wrote: Ken Smith <forget@it.com> wrote in message news:<407B759C.8040704@it.com>...Chas wrote:"Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote

> You're missing my more subtle point: that the indigenous PalestiniansYou misspelled 'TransJordanian Colonists'. They were there. Ihe European Jews hadn't been there for millenia. I don't claim a birthright to my ancestral home. Why should they? hey Ken, are seriously saying that the palestinians were living in the middle east (where Israel is today) before Israel came?

That's even what the Bible says!
do you seriously thing there was a palestinian civilization? if so, tell me all about them, I still couldnt find any information on palestinians BEFORE the late 1960s. Tell me about their people, about their culture, some type of currency they had, who was their leader? what did they built or have done in the past that they are proud of? what was the border? from what civilization in the history do they come from? what was their feeling when the ottomans (the turks) took the land from them.. and later what was their feeling when the british took the land away from them? did they even fighted? or even tried to resist? if so, how many died in the battle? wake up you moron,

This is why I generally refrain from these discussions -- you simply
cannot have a calm, rational discussion with a religious nutter of any
stripe. Islamists, Zionists, and our sadly virulent home-grown strain
of born again Christians, it scarcely makes a difference.

They'd all kill you for their ancient tribal sky-daddy....
these were jordanian refugees!

Even still, they were there before the *European* Jews. And under
Commonwealth law, they owned title to their plots of land.

Israel agreed to provide either repatriation or restitution to those
displaced as a condition of United Nations membership. Didn't happen.
What a surprise....
and they are till today not allowed to return to their homeland.. they have tried it several times and there was even a major battle and killing among these refugees and Jordan. (enter Black September in google to read on that).. avoid jewish, islamic and nazi sites please. Israel has minimum the same right to exist as the other arabic nations started and became independent during the same time:

Israel has no "right" to exist. What I'm interested in is creating
the conditions by which it would have *permission* to exist.

Ed wrote: "Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote in message news:407B759C.8040704@it.com...Chas wrote:"Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote> You're missing my more subtle point: that the indigenous PalestiniansYou misspelled 'TransJordanian Colonists'. They were there. Ihe European Jews hadn't been there for millenia. I don't claim a birthright to my ancestral home. Why should they? The point is that if you WANTED to live in your ancestral home, wherever it may be, you would be able to do so without fear of someone trying to kill you.

Hardly. In point of fact, I'd have to have their permission.

"Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote in message news:407C7D63.7010401@it.com... Ed wrote: "Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote in message
news:407B759C.8040704@it.com...Chas wrote:>"Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote>>> You're missing my more subtle point: that the indigenous
Palestinians>>You misspelled 'TransJordanian Colonists'. They were there. Ihe European Jews hadn't been there for millenia. I don't claim a birthright to my ancestral home. Why should they? The point is that if you WANTED to live in your ancestral home, wherever
it may be, you would be able to do so without fear of someone trying to
kill you. Hardly. In point of fact, I'd have to have their permission.

It's no different with Israel. You have to prove your Jewish heritage. I'm
not exactly sure what the criteria is, but if you meet the criteria, you
have "permission" to live there.

You would have to do the same thing, I suppose, but you could do so without
having to worry about some Islamofascist slob trying to kill you.

"Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote in message news:407C7D43.1080402@it.com... the neutral wrote: Ken Smith <forget@it.com> wrote in message
news:<407B759C.8040704@it.com>...Chas wrote:>"Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote>> You're missing my more subtle point: that the indigenous
Palestinians>>You misspelled 'TransJordanian Colonists'. They were there. Ihe European Jews hadn't been there for millenia. I don't claim a birthright to my ancestral home. Why should they? hey Ken, are seriously saying that the palestinians were living in the middle east (where Israel is today) before Israel came? That's even what the Bible says! do you seriously thing there was a palestinian civilization? if so, tell me all about them, I still couldnt find any information on palestinians BEFORE the late 1960s. Tell me about their people, about their culture, some type of currency they had, who was their leader? what did they built or have done in the past that they are proud of? what was the border? from what civilization in the history do they come from? what was their feeling when the ottomans (the turks) took the land from them.. and later what was their feeling when the british took the land away from them? did they even fighted? or even tried to resist? if so, how many died in the battle? wake up you moron, This is why I generally refrain from these discussions -- you simply cannot have a calm, rational discussion with a religious nutter of any stripe. Islamists, Zionists, and our sadly virulent home-grown strain of born again Christians, it scarcely makes a difference. They'd all kill you for their ancient tribal sky-daddy.... these were jordanian refugees! Even still, they were there before the *European* Jews. And under Commonwealth law, they owned title to their plots of land. Israel agreed to provide either repatriation or restitution to those displaced as a condition of United Nations membership. Didn't happen. What a surprise.... and they are till today not allowed to return to their homeland.. they have tried it several times and there was even a major battle and killing among these refugees and Jordan. (enter Black September in google to read on that).. avoid jewish, islamic and nazi sites please. Israel has minimum the same right to exist as the other arabic nations started and became independent during the same time: Israel has no "right" to exist. What I'm interested in is creating the conditions by which it would have *permission* to exist.

They already got permission. The UN granted permission in 1947. How
convenient you forget that.

Ed wrote: "Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote in message news:407C7D63.7010401@it.com...Ed wrote:"Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote in message news:407B759C.8040704@it.com...>Chas wrote:>>"Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote>>>>>>> You're missing my more subtle point: that the indigenous Palestinians
>>You misspelled 'TransJordanian Colonists'.>> They were there. Ihe European Jews hadn't been there for millenia.>> I don't claim a birthright to my ancestral home. Why should they?The point is that if you WANTED to live in your ancestral home, whereverit may be, you would be able to do so without fear of someone trying tokill you. Hardly. In point of fact, I'd have to have their permission. It's no different with Israel. You have to prove your Jewish heritage. I'm not exactly sure what the criteria is, but if you meet the criteria, you have "permission" to live there.

But the indigenous Palestinians, some of whom had title to their
land, duly recognized by the Crown, did not? You would have to do the same thing, I suppose, but you could do so without having to worry about some Islamofascist slob trying to kill you.

I can find no material differnce between the Islamofascist slobs and
the Zionist slobs, except that the Zionist slobs have better toys that
*we* gave them. If we armed the Pallies, at least it would be a fairer
fight.

I don't understand why they can't live side by side in peace, like we
do here in the States. Religious nutters are dangerous, no matter what
stripe they seem to be wearing. :(

Personally, I don't see the damned attraction to the place. It'd be
a little like fighting over Truth or Consequences, New Mexico....

Ed wrote: "Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote in message news:407C7D43.1080402@it.com...the neutral wrote:Ken Smith <forget@it.com> wrote in message news:<407B759C.8040704@it.com>...>Chas wrote:>>"Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote
>>> You're missing my more subtle point: that the indigenous Palestinians>>You misspelled 'TransJordanian Colonists'.>> They were there. Ihe European Jews hadn't been there for millenia.>> I don't claim a birthright to my ancestral home. Why should they?hey Ken, are seriously saying that the palestinians were living in themiddle east (where Israel is today) before Israel came? That's even what the Bible says!do youseriously thing there was a palestinian civilization? if so, tell meall about them, I still couldnt find any information on palestiniansBEFORE the late 1960s. Tell me about their people, about theirculture, some type of currency they had, who was their leader? whatdid they built or have done in the past that they are proud of? whatwas the border? from what civilization in the history do they comefrom?what was their feeling when the ottomans (the turks) took the landfrom them.. and later what was their feeling when the british took theland away from them? did they even fighted? or even tried to resist?if so, how many died in the battle?wake up you moron, This is why I generally refrain from these discussions -- you simplycannot have a calm, rational discussion with a religious nutter of anystripe. Islamists, Zionists, and our sadly virulent home-grown strainof born again Christians, it scarcely makes a difference. They'd all kill you for their ancient tribal sky-daddy....these were jordanian refugees! Even still, they were there before the *European* Jews. And underCommonwealth law, they owned title to their plots of land. Israel agreed to provide either repatriation or restitution to thosedisplaced as a condition of United Nations membership. Didn't happen.What a surprise....and they are tilltoday not allowed to return to their homeland.. they have tried itseveral times and there was even a major battle and killing amongthese refugees and Jordan. (enter Black September in google to read onthat).. avoid jewish, islamic and nazi sites please.Israel has minimum the same right to exist as the other arabic nationsstarted and became independent during the same time: Israel has no "right" to exist. What I'm interested in is creatingthe conditions by which it would have *permission* to exist. They already got permission. The UN granted permission in 1947. How convenient you forget that.

Subject to terms and conditions which have never been honored, and as
such, the state of Israel is in material breach. And correct me if I'm
wrong on this, but I didn't know the UN had title to any land to give.

anwar wrote: Let's take a moment and sympathize with Israelis: -Their grand-grand-grand parents were tortured. (so what? Armenians, Vietnamese, Kurds, Indians, Communists, Africans have all been tortured. That's history, don't bring it her today) -They are hated by everybody (that's true, I have to agree with that one) -They are a minority (See, a small country in a wide see of hatred. And they hope to survive with violence as their only way out. But by building hatred they are destroying their existence. I am half-jew myself, and my grandmother was well treated in an arab world, but today, there is no chance, because of the bad image ISRAEL has given to JEWS) -They have to face anti-semitism everyday ( actually, this is just a propaganda made by Israel. There is more anti-semitism against arabs than there is against jews) -They are full of fear (more to come in the future of course - unless they embrace peace and learn that a minority cannot keep ruling the world forever) Israel you make jews ashamed !!!!!



Thus Spake God's Creator; (I don't forgive nothing!)

SOME OF U.S./ISRAEL U.N. RESOLUTIONS VIOLATIONS.
------------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.us-israel.org/jsource/UN/usvetoes.html
http://www.washington-report.org/backissues/0393/9303040.htm

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
GOD'S CREATION ( My only sin... )

Wise men stare at the unknown, and boldly seeks answers !
Others... fall on their hands and knees, and start mumbling...


Today's Terrorists News:
http://www.antiwar.com/

Today's U.S. Terrorists:
http://www.dbr.nu/noin/rogues.html

> I don't understand why they can't live side by side in peace, like we do here in the States. Religious nutters are dangerous, no matter what stripe they seem to be wearing. :(

I agree with you on why they cant live side by side.. I am not in
favor of Israel or Jews, or whatever terms they use to describe them..
neither I am in favor for arabs or moslems etc.. I look it from a
logical perspective.

Your answer to why not living side by side is provided end of this
text,

I never said that they were no people living in that area before
Israel came, I said, there was no such thing as Palestinians claiming
that land before end 1960s..

the period from 1919 to 1970 is the time where all those arab nations
became independent including Israel. You have to realize that arabs
wouldnt have a problem with Israel if they were moslems. Thus all the
wars..

After all, Israel proved the world that they can leave in peace with
the arabs (Egypt, Jordan, Syria).. in a matter of fact, when Egypt
declared war to Israel some 30 years ago.. not only did Israel won the
war, but also captured the entire Sinai land. As you know Sinai is 3x
the size of Israel with Oil resources and all that.

Israel however agreed to return the land they have captured to Egypt
for ONE SINGLE REASON: for peace. Same game with Jordan and Syria..

But the question remains why they cant do that with the Palestinians?
(they dont even have oil or water on that land.. so why?)
Israel, the UN, the US and the European Union, and the Arab Nations
agreed to gave Palestinians there own state with 97% of region they
were asking and you know who didnt accept the offer?! guess who? Mr.
Dr.Prof. Yassir Arafat..
This is why no arab nation gives a **** about the palestinians!

Cause those Jordanian Refugees think they can own the whole place.
This is due to the brainwashing activities that is going on. I found
this website which is not 100% objective but it more or less gives the
answer to your question "why not living side by side".. It still uses
indisbutable facts that you can check yourself.


http://www.infoisrael.net/images/articles/what_do_the_palestinians_want.pps

-----------------------------------------------------
if palestinians would put down their weapons today, they will have
peace and their own state by the UN. If Israel would put down their
weapons today, there will be no Israel.
__________________________________________________ _____

Ken Smith <forget@it.com> wrote in message news:<407CA32A.4080909@it.com>... Ed wrote: "Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote in message news:407C7D63.7010401@it.com...Ed wrote:>"Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote in message news:407B759C.8040704@it.com...>>Chas wrote:>>>"Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote>>>>>>>>>> You're missing my more subtle point: that the indigenous Palestinians>>>You misspelled 'TransJordanian Colonists'.>>>> They were there. Ihe European Jews hadn't been there for millenia.>>>> I don't claim a birthright to my ancestral home. Why should they?>>The point is that if you WANTED to live in your ancestral home, wherever>it may be, you would be able to do so without fear of someone trying to>kill you. Hardly. In point of fact, I'd have to have their permission. It's no different with Israel. You have to prove your Jewish heritage. I'm not exactly sure what the criteria is, but if you meet the criteria, you have "permission" to live there. But the indigenous Palestinians, some of whom had title to their land, duly recognized by the Crown, did not?

Landowners sold their land and left duly so. A largely immigrant arab
mass from the neighbourhood had never hold any material "title" to
begin with.
You would have to do the same thing, I suppose, but you could do so without having to worry about some Islamofascist slob trying to kill you. I can find no material differnce between the Islamofascist slobs and the Zionist slobs, except that the Zionist slobs have better toys that *we* gave them.

It duly happens when the field of vision is materially closed.
If we armed the Pallies, at least it would be a fairer fight.

Then the whole dispute would have been duly and materially and
*quickly* ended.
I don't understand why they can't live side by side in peace, like we do here in the States. Religious nutters are dangerous, no matter what stripe they seem to be wearing. :( Personally, I don't see the damned attraction to the place.

The US?
(circumcised)

"Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote in message news:407CA340.5000500@it.com... Ed wrote: "Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote in message
news:407C7D43.1080402@it.com...the neutral wrote:>Ken Smith <forget@it.com> wrote in message news:<407B759C.8040704@it.com>...>>Chas wrote:>>>"Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote>>>> You're missing my more subtle point: that the indigenous
Palestinians>>>You misspelled 'TransJordanian Colonists'.>>>> They were there. Ihe European Jews hadn't been there for millenia.>>>> I don't claim a birthright to my ancestral home. Why should they?>>hey Ken, are seriously saying that the palestinians were living in the>middle east (where Israel is today) before Israel came? That's even what the Bible says!>do you>seriously thing there was a palestinian civilization? if so, tell me>all about them, I still couldnt find any information on palestinians>BEFORE the late 1960s. Tell me about their people, about their>culture, some type of currency they had, who was their leader? what>did they built or have done in the past that they are proud of? what>was the border? from what civilization in the history do they come>from?>what was their feeling when the ottomans (the turks) took the land>from them.. and later what was their feeling when the british took the>land away from them? did they even fighted? or even tried to resist?>if so, how many died in the battle?>>wake up you moron, This is why I generally refrain from these discussions -- you simplycannot have a calm, rational discussion with a religious nutter of anystripe. Islamists, Zionists, and our sadly virulent home-grown strainof born again Christians, it scarcely makes a difference. They'd all kill you for their ancient tribal sky-daddy....>these were jordanian refugees! Even still, they were there before the *European* Jews. And underCommonwealth law, they owned title to their plots of land. Israel agreed to provide either repatriation or restitution to thosedisplaced as a condition of United Nations membership. Didn't happen.What a surprise....>and they are till>today not allowed to return to their homeland.. they have tried it>several times and there was even a major battle and killing among>these refugees and Jordan. (enter Black September in google to read on>that).. avoid jewish, islamic and nazi sites please.>>Israel has minimum the same right to exist as the other arabic nations>started and became independent during the same time: Israel has no "right" to exist. What I'm interested in is creatingthe conditions by which it would have *permission* to exist. They already got permission. The UN granted permission in 1947. How convenient you forget that. Subject to terms and conditions which have never been honored,

by the Arab countries since they immediately declared war and invaded Israel
before the ink could dry on the UN resolution.

and as such, the state of Israel is in material breach.

Only because of the Arab countries dogged and criminal violation of the
ORIGINAL UN resolution.

And correct me if I'm wrong on this, but I didn't know the UN had title to any land to give.

The British, who were the "owners" of the land, had the title to partition
the land. It was sanctioned via resolution in the UN.

"Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote in message news:407CA32A.4080909@it.com... Ed wrote: "Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote in message
news:407C7D63.7010401@it.com...Ed wrote:>"Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote in message news:407B759C.8040704@it.com...>>Chas wrote:>>>"Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote>>>>>>>>>> You're missing my more subtle point: that the indigenous
Palestinians>>>You misspelled 'TransJordanian Colonists'.>>>> They were there. Ihe European Jews hadn't been there for millenia.>>>> I don't claim a birthright to my ancestral home. Why should they?>>The point is that if you WANTED to live in your ancestral home,
wherever>it may be, you would be able to do so without fear of someone trying to>kill you. Hardly. In point of fact, I'd have to have their permission. It's no different with Israel. You have to prove your Jewish heritage.
I'm not exactly sure what the criteria is, but if you meet the criteria, you have "permission" to live there. But the indigenous Palestinians, some of whom had title to their land, duly recognized by the Crown, did not?

The vast majority of Palestinians are NOT indigenous. They are refugees
from other Arab countries, notably Jordan, Syria, and Egypt, with a
smattering of Saudis.
You would have to do the same thing, I suppose, but you could do so
without having to worry about some Islamofascist slob trying to kill you. I can find no material differnce between the Islamofascist slobs and the Zionist slobs, except that the Zionist slobs have better toys that *we* gave them. If we armed the Pallies, at least it would be a fairer fight.

Perhaps. But if the Pallies only accepted the existence of Israel from day
one, there wouldn't have to be a fight at all.
I don't understand why they can't live side by side in peace, like we do here in the States. Religious nutters are dangerous, no matter what stripe they seem to be wearing. :( Personally, I don't see the damned attraction to the place. It'd be a little like fighting over Truth or Consequences, New Mexico....

Ed wrote: "Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote in message news:407CA340.5000500@it.com...

[snip]
And correct me if I'mwrong on this, but I didn't know the UN had title to any land to give. The British, who were the "owners" of the land, had the title to partition the land. It was sanctioned via resolution in the UN.

Not exactly -- and the devil is in the details. Commonwealth law
does not allow for it, for native title survives the transfer of
sovereignty. The Crown did not have the legal authority to
extinguish title.

Ed wrote: "Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote in message news:407CA32A.4080909@it.com...
I can find no material difference between the Islamofascist slobs andthe Zionist slobs, except that the Zionist slobs have better toys that*we* gave them. If we armed the Pallies, at least it would be a fairerfight. Perhaps. But if the Pallies only accepted the existence of Israel from day one, there wouldn't have to be a fight at all.

Aaaaahhh. The Bobby Knight theory.

As long as the rapist gets his rocks off, he doesn't mind if the
woman doesn't put up a fight. End result is still the same, though.

"Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote in message news:407E785C.7010304@it.com... Ed wrote: "Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote in message
news:407CA32A.4080909@it.com... I can find no material difference between the Islamofascist slobs andthe Zionist slobs, except that the Zionist slobs have better toys that*we* gave them. If we armed the Pallies, at least it would be a fairerfight. Perhaps. But if the Pallies only accepted the existence of Israel from
day one, there wouldn't have to be a fight at all. Aaaaahhh. The Bobby Knight theory. As long as the rapist gets his rocks off, he doesn't mind if the woman doesn't put up a fight. End result is still the same, though.

How so? With the partition, Israel was more than happy to take what was
allotted to them. It was the Arabs that refused to accept THEIR share of
the partition. They wanted it ALL!!

So yes, Israel, as "the woman" was forced into putting up a fight....
repeatedly!

"Ed" <No_Spam@do_not_spam_me.net> wrote in message
news:75idnYr79JPeleLdRVn-hg@comcast.com... "Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote in message
news:407E785C.7010304@it.com... Ed wrote: "Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote in message news:407CA32A.4080909@it.com...> I can find no material difference between the Islamofascist slobs
and>the Zionist slobs, except that the Zionist slobs have better toys that>*we* gave them. If we armed the Pallies, at least it would be a
fairer>fight. Perhaps. But if the Pallies only accepted the existence of Israel
from day one, there wouldn't have to be a fight at all. Aaaaahhh. The Bobby Knight theory. As long as the rapist gets his rocks off, he doesn't mind if the woman doesn't put up a fight. End result is still the same, though. How so? With the partition, Israel was more than happy to take what was allotted to them. It was the Arabs that refused to accept THEIR share of the partition. They wanted it ALL!! So yes, Israel, as "the woman" was forced into putting up a fight.... repeatedly!


Originally, the British promised the entire region, as-a-whole, autonomy as
a democracy. Dividing it into Jewish and non-Jewish sectors wasn't part of
any deal pitched to the Middle Eastern countries until AFTER WWII. In other
words, of course the "Arabs wanted it all" -that is what Britain promised
them.

That doesn't have any political significance today, but its part of the
historical perspective that Moslem leaders use to inflame their followers
against Israel and the West.

Ken Smith <forget@it.com> wrote in message news:<407E7852.3030507@it.com>... Ed wrote: "Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote in message news:407CA340.5000500@it.com... [snip]And correct me if I'mwrong on this, but I didn't know the UN had title to any land to give. The British, who were the "owners" of the land, had the title to partition the land. It was sanctioned via resolution in the UN. Not exactly -- and the devil is in the details. Commonwealth law does not allow for it, for native title survives the transfer of sovereignty. The Crown did not have the legal authority to extinguish title.

And the devil is in one detail: you post pseudo-legal bull**** and
bollocks.
In 1788, British common law recognised three methods by which the
Crown could legitimately acquire new territory and claim sovereignty
over it. If the land was already occupied, the Crown could claim that
it had acquired the land from the Indigenous peoples by:
1. military conquest.
2. by cession. If the land was terra nullius it could claim that it
had acquired the territory by 3)occupation.
If a colony was established on land acquired by conquest or by
cession, the British common law was obliged to recognise and respect
both Indigenous property rights in the land and the larger systems of
Indigenous law and government (nonexistent in Palestine after the
defeat of the Ottomans).
If a colony was established on land acquired by occupation or
settlement, the British common law commenced operation unburdened by
the obligation to recognise Indigenous law (nonexistent after the
defeat of the Ottomans), but was still required to respect indigenous
property rights in the land.
Admit to intentional misinterpretation, stop bothering misc.legal and
us.legal with your crap spam and let us move palestinians® to the
greener pastures of the great arab void, inshallah.

"Terence Fformby-Smythe" <baboon@mighty.co.za> wrote in message
It is quite probable that the Americans when they find out how the Jooze and
their gentile goyim have lied and deceived them for sixty years will unleash
such ferocity against the state of Israel and amongst the Jooze in their own
heartlands, that the Jooze both as a race and a religion will cease to
exist, and that can only be a "Good" thing for the peoples of the world.
The lessons learned from this encounter will in short order produce amongst
the Islamic hordes such fear they might well become apostate or convert to
other religions thus consigning Islam to the dustbowl of history.

Bigot wrote: "Terence Fformby-Smythe" <baboon@mighty.co.za> wrote in message It is quite probable that the Americans when they find out how the Jooze and their gentile goyim have lied and deceived them for sixty years will unleash such ferocity against the state of Israel and amongst the Jooze in their own heartlands, that the Jooze both as a race and a religion will cease to exist, and that can only be a "Good" thing for the peoples of the world.

The "Jooze" will continue to exist long after the day that the only
record of your existence will be from your file at the psyche ward.
The lessons learned from this encounter will in short order produce amongst the Islamic hordes such fear they might well become apostate or convert to other religions thus consigning Islam to the dustbowl of history.

"Sheldon Liberman" <sheldon.liberman@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:407FC857.6090402@sympatico.ca... Bigot wrote: "Terence Fformby-Smythe" <baboon@mighty.co.za> wrote in message It is quite probable that the Americans when they find out how the Jooze
and their gentile goyim have lied and deceived them for sixty years will
unleash such ferocity against the state of Israel and amongst the Jooze in their
own heartlands, that the Jooze both as a race and a religion will cease to exist, and that can only be a "Good" thing for the peoples of the world. The "Jooze" will continue to exist long after the day that the only record of your existence will be from your file at the psyche ward.

Thank you Dr. Liberman for that unsolicited but very welcome assesment of my
mental condition, how much do I owe you?

The lessons learned from this encounter will in short order produce
amongst the Islamic hordes such fear they might well become apostate or convert
to other religions thus consigning Islam to the dustbowl of history.

Bigot wrote: "Sheldon Liberman" <sheldon.liberman@sympatico.ca> wrote in message news:407FC857.6090402@sympatico.ca...Bigot wrote:"Terence Fformby-Smythe" <baboon@mighty.co.za> wrote in messageIt is quite probable that the Americans when they find out how the Jooze andtheir gentile goyim have lied and deceived them for sixty years will unleashsuch ferocity against the state of Israel and amongst the Jooze in their ownheartlands, that the Jooze both as a race and a religion will cease toexist, and that can only be a "Good" thing for the peoples of the world.The "Jooze" will continue to exist long after the day that the onlyrecord of your existence will be from your file at the psyche ward. Thank you Dr. Liberman for that unsolicited but very welcome assesment of my mental condition, how much do I owe you?

Nothing in terms of dollars and cents. Simply resolve not to pay your
debt with an axe or an icepick. You never know....
The lessons learned from this encounter will in short order produce amongstthe Islamic hordes such fear they might well become apostate or convert toother religions thus consigning Islam to the dustbowl of history.

"Bigot" <someone@microshaft.com> wrote in message
news:c5oge5$3sebl$1@ID-229054.news.uni-berlin.de... It is quite probable that the Americans when they find out how the Jooze
and their gentile goyim have lied and deceived them for sixty years will
unleash such ferocity against the state of Israel and amongst the Jooze in their
own heartlands, that the Jooze both as a race and a religion will cease to exist, and that can only be a "Good" thing for the peoples of the world. The lessons learned from this encounter will in short order produce
amongst the Islamic hordes such fear they might well become apostate or convert to other religions thus consigning Islam to the dustbowl of history.

Told you he was mad :-)

baboon@mighty.co.za (Terence Fformby-Smythe) wrote in message news:<cec18032.0404160315.57618005@posting.google.com>... Ken Smith <forget@it.com> wrote in message news:<407E7852.3030507@it.com>... Ed wrote: "Ken Smith" <forget@it.com> wrote in message news:407CA340.5000500@it.com... [snip]>And correct me if I'm>wrong on this, but I didn't know the UN had title to any land to give. The British, who were the "owners" of the land, had the title to partition the land. It was sanctioned via resolution in the UN. Not exactly -- and the devil is in the details. Commonwealth law does not allow for it, for native title survives the transfer of sovereignty. The Crown did not have the legal authority to extinguish title. And the devil is in one detail: you post pseudo-legal bull**** and bollocks.

b'll**** and b'llocks is the b'nai b'riths job
In 1788, British common law recognised three methods by which the Crown could legitimately acquire new territory and claim sovereignty over it. If the land was already occupied, the Crown could claim that it had acquired the land from the Indigenous peoples by: 1. military conquest.

b'ritish common law is b'llocks
except in b'ritain
tell the tony blair
2. by cession. If the land was terra nullius it could claim that it had acquired the territory by 3)occupation. If a colony was established on land acquired by conquest or by cession, the British common law was obliged to recognise and respect both Indigenous property rights in the land and the larger systems of Indigenous law and government (nonexistent in Palestine after the defeat of the Ottomans). If a colony was established on land acquired by occupation or settlement, the British common law commenced operation unburdened by the obligation to recognise Indigenous law (nonexistent after the defeat of the Ottomans), but was still required to respect indigenous property rights in the land. Admit to intentional misinterpretation, stop bothering misc.legal and us.legal with your crap spam and let us move palestinians® to the greener pastures of the great arab void, inshallah.

and leave israel to the joovish immigrants
its a g-d-given mitzvah
but its a g-d-forsaken place
enjoy already ;)

"Sheldon Liberman" <sheldon.liberman@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:4080509A.1050005@sympatico.ca... Bigot wrote: "Sheldon Liberman" <sheldon.liberman@sympatico.ca> wrote in message news:407FC857.6090402@sympatico.ca...Bigot wrote:>"Terence Fformby-Smythe" <baboon@mighty.co.za> wrote in message>It is quite probable that the Americans when they find out how the
Jooze and>their gentile goyim have lied and deceived them for sixty years will unleash>such ferocity against the state of Israel and amongst the Jooze in
their own>heartlands, that the Jooze both as a race and a religion will cease to>exist, and that can only be a "Good" thing for the peoples of the
world.The "Jooze" will continue to exist long after the day that the onlyrecord of your existence will be from your file at the psyche ward. Thank you Dr. Liberman for that unsolicited but very welcome assesment
of my mental condition, how much do I owe you? Nothing in terms of dollars and cents. Simply resolve not to pay your debt with an axe or an icepick. You never know....

I don't think I'll be popping over to Mexico in the near future, besides
Trotsky was important:-))

"Ed" <No_Spam@do_not_spam_me.net> wrote in message
news:O4-dnVDf56cgxh3d4p2dnA@comcast.com... "Bigot" <someone@microshaft.com> wrote in message news:c5oge5$3sebl$1@ID-229054.news.uni-berlin.de... It is quite probable that the Americans when they find out how the Jooze and their gentile goyim have lied and deceived them for sixty years wi