Gosh, it's only January 5, and I've already found the quote of the year:

There's no better form of adoption than the parent having
the opportunity to experience pregnancy and delivery,"
Stevens said. "People can have the assurance that this is
going to be done in a professional manner, with all the
best science possible to make sure that those embryos have
a chance for life."

From Focus on the Family

Marley

EMBRYO DONATION CENTER OPENS:
A new national program hopes to create adoption matches
that are "made in heaven."
http://www.family.org/cforum/fnif/news/a0029624.cfm

FAMILY NEWS IN FOCUS STORIES:
-----------------------------------------------------
Embryo Donation Center Opens
by Terry Phillips, correspondent

SUMMARY: A new national program hopes to create adoption
matches that are "made in heaven."

The Christian Medical Association, hoping to rescue some
of the 400,000 human embryos frozen at fertility clinics
nationwide, has created a national embryo adoption
program.

The excess embryos are the byproduct of the in-vitro
fertilization technique used in fertility clinics, which
requires that a half dozen or more embryos be created to
provide additional chances for a woman to become pregnant.
The success rate has created adoption possibilities,
according to Dr. David Stevens, who heads up the Christian
Medical Association, which has joined with the
Southeastern Fertility Center in Knoxville, Tenn., to
establish the National Embryo Donation Center.

"There's no better form of adoption than the parent having
the opportunity to experience pregnancy and delivery,"
Stevens said. "People can have the assurance that this is
going to be done in a professional manner, with all the
best science possible to make sure that those embryos have
a chance for life."

Right now, there is no shortage of couples wanting to
adopt an embryo, but there is a shortage of donations,
according to Dr. Jeffrey Keenan, director of the embryo
center. Couples wanting to donate embryos have several
options, including having them transferred anonymously, or
they can be involved in the process of selecting the
potential parents.

"We (have) only started the media-awareness campaign,"
Keenan said. "We have over 50 people on the waiting list,
and right now we only have seven sets of donated embryos."


Keenan is pleading with couples that have stored their
embryos to consider donating to the center.

"Each one of these embryos," he said, "has the potential
to become a human being, like you or I."

But embryos can survive in a frozen state for only six or
seven years.

"The clock is ticking," Stevens said, "because no decision
is a decision to let the child die."

He said the decision to donate is, in the most perfect
sense, the gift of life.

FOR MORE INFORMATION: A news release on the Christian
Medical Association Web site offers more about the center.

http://www.cmdahome.org/index.cgi?BISKIT=3744534208&CONTEXT=art&art=2498

(NOTE: Referral to Web sites not produced by Focus on the
Family is for informational purposes only and does not
constitute an endorsement of the sites' content.)

Marley Greiner wrote:
Gosh, it's only January 5, and I've already found the quote of the year: There's no better form of adoption than the parent having the opportunity to experience pregnancy and delivery," Stevens said. "People can have the assurance that this is going to be done in a professional manner, with all the best science possible to make sure that those embryos have a chance for life."

That's a doozy alright. The perfect simulacrum, giving birth to your
adopted child. I can imagine the therapeutic future of adoptees - adoption
conference workshops held in walk-in freezers to trigger pre-natal memories
of storage...

Ron
From Focus on the Family Marley EMBRYO DONATION CENTER OPENS: A new national program hopes to create adoption matches that are "made in heaven." http://www.family.org/cforum/fnif/news/a0029624.cfm FAMILY NEWS IN FOCUS STORIES: ----------------------------------------------------- Embryo Donation Center Opens by Terry Phillips, correspondent SUMMARY: A new national program hopes to create adoption matches that are "made in heaven." The Christian Medical Association, hoping to rescue some of the 400,000 human embryos frozen at fertility clinics nationwide, has created a national embryo adoption program. The excess embryos are the byproduct of the in-vitro fertilization technique used in fertility clinics, which requires that a half dozen or more embryos be created to provide additional chances for a woman to become pregnant. The success rate has created adoption possibilities, according to Dr. David Stevens, who heads up the Christian Medical Association, which has joined with the Southeastern Fertility Center in Knoxville, Tenn., to establish the National Embryo Donation Center. "There's no better form of adoption than the parent having the opportunity to experience pregnancy and delivery," Stevens said. "People can have the assurance that this is going to be done in a professional manner, with all the best science possible to make sure that those embryos have a chance for life." Right now, there is no shortage of couples wanting to adopt an embryo, but there is a shortage of donations, according to Dr. Jeffrey Keenan, director of the embryo center. Couples wanting to donate embryos have several options, including having them transferred anonymously, or they can be involved in the process of selecting the potential parents. "We (have) only started the media-awareness campaign," Keenan said. "We have over 50 people on the waiting list, and right now we only have seven sets of donated embryos." Keenan is pleading with couples that have stored their embryos to consider donating to the center. "Each one of these embryos," he said, "has the potential to become a human being, like you or I." But embryos can survive in a frozen state for only six or seven years. "The clock is ticking," Stevens said, "because no decision is a decision to let the child die." He said the decision to donate is, in the most perfect sense, the gift of life. FOR MORE INFORMATION: A news release on the Christian Medical Association Web site offers more about the center. http://www.cmdahome.org/index.cgi?BISKIT=3744534208&CONTEXT=art&art=2498 (NOTE: Referral to Web sites not produced by Focus on the Family is for informational purposes only and does not constitute an endorsement of the sites' content.)

Ron Morgan <rhyzome1@earthlink.net> wrote in message news:<3FFAB5D0.5334C642@earthlink.net>... Marley Greiner wrote: Gosh, it's only January 5, and I've already found the quote of the year: There's no better form of adoption than the parent having the opportunity to experience pregnancy and delivery," Stevens said. "People can have the assurance that this is going to be done in a professional manner, with all the best science possible to make sure that those embryos have a chance for life." That's a doozy alright. The perfect simulacrum, giving birth to your adopted child. I can imagine the therapeutic future of adoptees - adoption conference workshops held in walk-in freezers to trigger pre-natal memories of storage... Ron

And there are those who argue that infant adoption is not about curing
infertility. To that I say piffle.

Di From Focus on the Family Marley EMBRYO DONATION CENTER OPENS: A new national program hopes to create adoption matches that are "made in heaven." http://www.family.org/cforum/fnif/news/a0029624.cfm FAMILY NEWS IN FOCUS STORIES: ----------------------------------------------------- Embryo Donation Center Opens by Terry Phillips, correspondent SUMMARY: A new national program hopes to create adoption matches that are "made in heaven." The Christian Medical Association, hoping to rescue some of the 400,000 human embryos frozen at fertility clinics nationwide, has created a national embryo adoption program. The excess embryos are the byproduct of the in-vitro fertilization technique used in fertility clinics, which requires that a half dozen or more embryos be created to provide additional chances for a woman to become pregnant. The success rate has created adoption possibilities, according to Dr. David Stevens, who heads up the Christian Medical Association, which has joined with the Southeastern Fertility Center in Knoxville, Tenn., to establish the National Embryo Donation Center. "There's no better form of adoption than the parent having the opportunity to experience pregnancy and delivery," Stevens said. "People can have the assurance that this is going to be done in a professional manner, with all the best science possible to make sure that those embryos have a chance for life." Right now, there is no shortage of couples wanting to adopt an embryo, but there is a shortage of donations, according to Dr. Jeffrey Keenan, director of the embryo center. Couples wanting to donate embryos have several options, including having them transferred anonymously, or they can be involved in the process of selecting the potential parents. "We (have) only started the media-awareness campaign," Keenan said. "We have over 50 people on the waiting list, and right now we only have seven sets of donated embryos." Keenan is pleading with couples that have stored their embryos to consider donating to the center. "Each one of these embryos," he said, "has the potential to become a human being, like you or I." But embryos can survive in a frozen state for only six or seven years. "The clock is ticking," Stevens said, "because no decision is a decision to let the child die." He said the decision to donate is, in the most perfect sense, the gift of life. FOR MORE INFORMATION: A news release on the Christian Medical Association Web site offers more about the center. http://www.cmdahome.org/index.cgi?BISKIT=3744534208&CONTEXT=art&art=2498 (NOTE: Referral to Web sites not produced by Focus on the Family is for informational purposes only and does not constitute an endorsement of the sites' content.)

>And there are those who argue that infant adoption is not about curinginfertility. To that I say piffle.Di


If there are those, Di, who say adopting a child does not cure infertility,
that would be because it doesn't. Infertility is a medical condition. Adoption
might "cure" childlessness, but has no impact whatsoever on a man's sperm
count, the condition of a woman's fallopian tubes or the fact that two people
cannot make a pregnancy.

But, you knew this, right?


P2P

"Palms2pines" <palms2pines@aol.comh8spam> wrote in message
news:20040107151443.04155.00002724@mb-m29.aol.com...And there are those who argue that infant adoption is not about curinginfertility. To that I say piffle.Di If there are those, Di, who say adopting a child does not cure
infertility, that would be because it doesn't. Infertility is a medical condition.
Adoption might "cure" childlessness, but has no impact whatsoever on a man's sperm count, the condition of a woman's fallopian tubes or the fact that two
people cannot make a pregnancy. But, you knew this, right? P2P

I've seen literature where it does say exactly that, but I suppose it means
in "psychological" terms. Obviously it's a lie. When we talk about embryo
adoption, though, we're entering a whole new world of Let's Pretend where
the woman gets somebody else's embryo implanted in her and gets to
experience the "joy" of pregnancy and flip-flop in her in her mind that this
is a bio kid.

Does anybody remember years ago on One Life to Live when Delia had Sarah's
(?) embryo implanted in her after Sarah died. It's been so long I can't
remember the whole thing expect us all sitting around Drake Union laughing
at the idea.

Marley

Marley:

<snip>
When we talk about embryoadoption, though, we're entering a whole new world of Let's Pretend wherethe woman gets somebody else's embryo implanted in her and gets toexperience the "joy" of pregnancy and flip-flop in her in her mind that thisis a bio kid.


<snip>

Any procedure that results in a woman's pregnancy and live birth could
accurately be called a "cure" for infertility, IMO. I would not assume a woman
who became pregnant by either a donated egg or donated sperm is pretending
anything, however. No reason to feel scorn for these people, Marley. I
mean...no more scorn than your usual for people who produce/raise children.


P2P

palms2pines@aol.comh8spam (Palms2pines) wrote in message news:<20040107151443.04155.00002724@mb-m29.aol.com>...And there are those who argue that infant adoption is not about curinginfertility. To that I say piffle.Di If there are those, Di, who say adopting a child does not cure infertility, that would be because it doesn't.


Aw come on P2P. It is a placebo cure, a psychological cure to
infertility and you know it. It alleviates the craving for a baby and
it's a last resoirt when all else fails. All fertility sites include
adoption as a last Hurrah and all adoption sites include how their
fertility treatments faied and how they had ot resport to adoption.

Infertility is a medical condition. Adoption might "cure" childlessness, but has no impact whatsoever on a man's sperm count, the condition of a woman's fallopian tubes or the fact that two people cannot make a pregnancy.

Come on now, once you have a baby to call your own you magically
forget about the grief of infertility according to all the ap's on
adoption sites. They aren't whining about being infertile as they did
when posting on fertility sites. "Oh I wish I had thought of adoption
sooner as I wouldn't have bothered going through all those costly
fertility treatments that didn't work. I got me a baby anyway through
adoption. I am now complete."

As I've said, adopting someone elses infant a placebo cure, a
psyhchological cure for one's infertilty. It can't be denied. It's
what infant adoption was all about.
But, you knew this, right?
I dunno. Adoption used to be used as a fertility charm in my day. It
was believed that if you adopted it relaxed the amother and she would
likely have a child of her own. Happened in quite a few cases
according to Medical Journals.


Di P2P

"Marley Greiner" <maddogmarley@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message news:<4V1Lb.9630$214.299656@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>... "Palms2pines" <palms2pines@aol.comh8spam> wrote in message news:20040107151443.04155.00002724@mb-m29.aol.com...And there are those who argue that infant adoption is not about curinginfertility. To that I say piffle.Di If there are those, Di, who say adopting a child does not cure infertility, that would be because it doesn't. Infertility is a medical condition. Adoption might "cure" childlessness, but has no impact whatsoever on a man's sperm count, the condition of a woman's fallopian tubes or the fact that two people cannot make a pregnancy. But, you knew this, right? P2P I've seen literature where it does say exactly that, but I suppose it means in "psychological" terms. Obviously it's a lie. When we talk about embryo adoption, though, we're entering a whole new world of Let's Pretend where the woman gets somebody else's embryo implanted in her and gets to experience the "joy" of pregnancy and flip-flop in her in her mind that this is a bio kid.


The reason infant adoption became de rigeur was to give childless
couple the experience of raising an infant birth. The only difference
was not going through the birth canal. And the medical profession
would tell them that when advising them to adopt once all fertilty
treatment failed.
Anyone can read that old literature in any Medical Journal and the
older adoption agency material. It's hardly new news.

Di
Does anybody remember years ago on One Life to Live when Delia had Sarah's (?) embryo implanted in her after Sarah died. It's been so long I can't remember the whole thing expect us all sitting around Drake Union laughing at the idea. Marley

"Palms2pines" <palms2pines@aol.comh8spam> wrote in message
news:20040107232047.15365.00002782@mb-m03.aol.com... Marley: <snip>When we talk about embryoadoption, though, we're entering a whole new world of Let's Pretend wherethe woman gets somebody else's embryo implanted in her and gets toexperience the "joy" of pregnancy and flip-flop in her in her mind that
thisis a bio kid. <snip> Any procedure that results in a woman's pregnancy and live birth could accurately be called a "cure" for infertility, IMO. I would not assume a
woman who became pregnant by either a donated egg or donated sperm is pretending anything, however. No reason to feel scorn for these people, Marley. I mean...no more scorn than your usual for people who produce/raise
children. P2P

Well you're a normal person, P. In fact, everybody here is pretty normal
except for our absent friends PlayRoy and MoRon. But there's lots of people
out there in the real world who are a bit wacky. Here's a funny quote from
an embryo mom:
http://www.snowflakes.org/quotes.htm
It's an incredible concept that I am both birthmother and adopting mother. I
will provide oxygen, nutrients, a warm place to grow, and love. >What an
awesome story we'll have to tell our children - that God let one family
start them and another family complete them."
Snowflake Adoptive Mother

And just take a look around www.snowflakes.org in general.

Here's a rather flakey story"
http://www.fri-wi.org/Media/Radio%20Commentary%20Transcripts/401%20Snowflake%20Moms%20and%20Babies.htm

IMO, People go the embryo route because the idea of an already born human
squicks them for some reason. It's not really theirs.

Marley

>Subject: Re: More on embryo adoption--the best form of adoptionFrom: patrice68@bigpond.com.au (Dian)Date: 1/7/04 10:46 PM Pacific Standard TimeMessage-id: <c599139c.0401072246.7dd90640@posting.google.com>

(snip)

There are lots of people that adopted and adopt infants and it doesn't mean
that they are infertile. And some that are infertile have the same needs as
biological parents do. The need to raise children. See it works like this,
Di...People place infants because for some reason they can't or won't parent,
and some people adopt them because they can and will parent.

Why are you always beating the same old drum, Di?
As I've said, adopting someone elses infant a placebo cure, apsyhchological cure for one's infertilty. It can't be denied. It'swhat infant adoption was all about.
Di



Kathy
"To err is human; to forgive, divine."

Di asserts:
Aw come on P2P. It is a placebo cure, a psychological cure toinfertility and you know it. >>

Baloney, Di. There are many, many adoptive parents who, when told they would
not likely cause a pregnancy together, went straight to efforts to adopt.
People who decide to make a plan to parent who find out the mechanics required
for pregnancy are not likely fully functioning will soon reach a crossroads.
At this crossroads they have to ask, "Are we pursuing pregnancy and then
parenthood or parenthood?" You really don't know many adoptive parents, do
you?


Adoption used to be used as a fertility charm in my day. Itwas believed that if you adopted it relaxed the amother and she wouldlikely have a child of her own. Happened in quite a few casesaccording to Medical Journals.>>

Doubt it. You might find a dusty old medical reference that suggests adopting
will help a woman get pregnant. However, that is folklore and medical experts
have known it for a very long time. Adopting has no impact on a man's sperm
count or a woman's reproductive organs. A woman has an identical chance of
getting pregnant after adopting as she had before.


P2P

***top***

How succinct, Kathy.

Kathy writes:
See it works like this,Di...People place infants because for some reason they can't or won't parent,and some people adopt them because they can and will parent.




P2P

>The reason infant adoption became de rigeur was to give childlesscouple the experience of raising an infant birth. The only differencewas not going through the birth canal. And the medical professionwould tell them that when advising them to adopt once all fertiltytreatment failed.Anyone can read that old literature in any Medical Journal and theolder adoption agency material. It's hardly new news.Di


You're a hoot, Di. I'll bet I can find an old medical journal that also
recommends blood letting. I could probably find one that recommends a wide
variety of things we would find hilarious today. What is your point about old
medical journals? Do you have a point?


P2P

>IMO, People go the embryo route because the idea of an already born humansquicks them for some reason. It's not really theirs.Marley


Marley, people go the embryo route for the same reasons many spend huge bucks
on other fertility treatments; because experiencing a pregnancy is *very, very*
important to them. I do know some women who are as interested in experiencing
pregnancy as they are raising children. Most of these women (couples) are not
interested in adopting. It is just not the journey they seek. I seriously
cannot imagine your feeling scorn for them. Why would anyone? There is nothing
at all wrong with wanting to be pregnant and wanting it very, very much. It is
a personal choice. Why bother criticizing?


P2P

"Palms2pines" <palms2pines@aol.comh8spam> wrote in message
news:20040108145445.07996.00002439@mb-m16.aol.com...IMO, People go the embryo route because the idea of an already born humansquicks them for some reason. It's not really theirs.Marley Marley, people go the embryo route for the same reasons many spend huge
bucks on other fertility treatments; because experiencing a pregnancy is *very,
very* important to them. I do know some women who are as interested in
experiencing pregnancy as they are raising children.

Why would anybody want to experience pregnancy? Except to get attention.
Look at me. I can pop a sprog. Oh, boy. That's certainly an
accomplishment to be proud of.


Most of these women (couples) are not interested in adopting. It is just not the journey they seek. I seriously cannot imagine your feeling scorn for them. Why would anyone? There is
nothing at all wrong with wanting to be pregnant and wanting it very, very much.
It is a personal choice. Why bother criticizing?


Because they are stupid and suicidal. Hmm, perhaps I should encourage it
then. P2P

Marley

palms2pines@aol.comh8spam (Palms2pines) wrote in message news:<20040108145445.07996.00002439@mb-m16.aol.com>...IMO, People go the embryo route because the idea of an already born humansquicks them for some reason. It's not really theirs.Marley Marley, people go the embryo route for the same reasons many spend huge bucks on other fertility treatments; because experiencing a pregnancy is *very, very* important to them. I do know some women who are as interested in experiencing pregnancy as they are raising children. Most of these women (couples) are not interested in adopting. It is just not the journey they seek. I seriously cannot imagine your feeling scorn for them. Why would anyone? There is nothing at all wrong with wanting to be pregnant and wanting it very, very much.


I've met a couple of women who just *love* being pregnant.
They crave the 'experience' of pregnancy for it's *own* sake. They say
they like the plenitude, that it makes them feel all warm and glowy.
I must say they do seem to be able to just about tolerate the
resulting kids, but the main point for them seems to be 'being'
pregnant.

The other day I met an 'educated' woman (masters in history) who was
pregnant with her 10th (eeek!) child. She seemed complacent, though
not particularly happy. She said she adored being pregnant, that it
made her feel significant. Yikes.

I suppose the resultant kids grow up, pursue the same ignis fatuous
(search for meaning) . . . and so on, ad infinitum.

Some (people like Marley, and my friends N and D) break the cycle.
Of course, it avails them nout.
A Hobson's choice.


Rh (bleak, but cheery)





a personal choice. Why bother criticizing? P2P

"Rhiannon" <sarallewellyn@gosympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:dafc70.0401081535.5cfdb17e@posting.google.com ... palms2pines@aol.comh8spam (Palms2pines) wrote in message
news:<20040108145445.07996.00002439@mb-m16.aol.com>...IMO, People go the embryo route because the idea of an already born
humansquicks them for some reason. It's not really theirs.Marley Marley, people go the embryo route for the same reasons many spend huge
bucks on other fertility treatments; because experiencing a pregnancy is
*very, very* important to them. I do know some women who are as interested in
experiencing pregnancy as they are raising children. Most of these women (couples)
are not interested in adopting. It is just not the journey they seek. I
seriously cannot imagine your feeling scorn for them. Why would anyone? There is
nothing at all wrong with wanting to be pregnant and wanting it very, very much. I've met a couple of women who just *love* being pregnant. They crave the 'experience' of pregnancy for it's *own* sake. They say they like the plenitude, that it makes them feel all warm and glowy. I must say they do seem to be able to just about tolerate the resulting kids, but the main point for them seems to be 'being' pregnant.

We had a grad student like that. By the time she had her doctorate she had
4 kids and 3 husbands. Marriage #2 ended when she learned Hubbykins put
pictures of her in some amateur porn magazine. The other day I met an 'educated' woman (masters in history) who was pregnant with her 10th (eeek!) child. She seemed complacent, though not particularly happy. She said she adored being pregnant, that it made her feel significant. Yikes.

I suppose it's a good thing then that she can procreate, since if she
couldn't she'd be invisible at best.
I suppose the resultant kids grow up, pursue the same ignis fatuous (search for meaning) . . . and so on, ad infinitum.

I'd be suprrised if they have big famlies of their own. By bgrandmother
came from a family of 10 or 11. All of them had small families. My
bgrandmother had 1 kid (my bmom) who was born 9 months and 2 days afterthe
wedding. Did the Dionne's have any kids amongst them? Some (people like Marley, and my friends N and D) break the cycle. Of course, it avails them nout. A Hobson's choice. Rh (bleak, but cheery)

Marley a personal choice. Why bother criticizing? P2P

>The other day I met an 'educated' woman (masters in history) who waspregnant with her 10th (eeek!)>

EEK! is right, Rh. I was once told by a young woman pregnant with her fifth
child (she had the first one at age 15) that she loved being pregnant for just
the reason you mentioned--it made her feel important. She said she felt she had
a purpose when a child was gestating inside her and pregnancy garnered much
needed attention. She was quite oblivious to the fates of the resulting
children. It wasn't parenthood she sought at all, only pregnancy.




P2P

In article <MVlLb.10386$Ub6.277180@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>, "Marley
Greiner" <maddogmarley@worldnet.att.net> writes:

<snip>
I suppose the resultant kids grow up, pursue the same ignis fatuous (search for meaning) . . . and so on, ad infinitum.I'd be suprrised if they have big famlies of their own. By bgrandmothercame from a family of 10 or 11. All of them had small families. Mybgrandmother had 1 kid (my bmom) who was born 9 months and 2 days afterthewedding. Did the Dionne's have any kids amongst them?

FWIW, my mom gave birth to 11. Of the 10 who lived to be old enough to consider
it, 1 had 7, 2 had 3, 1 had 2, 3 had 1, 1 adopted and 2 have yet to be heard
from.

J.




Reply to jmhjmd at aol.

"Marley Greiner" <maddogmarley@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message news:<MVlLb.10386$Ub6.277180@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>... "Rhiannon" <sarallewellyn@gosympatico.ca> wrote in message news:dafc70.0401081535.5cfdb17e@posting.google.com ... palms2pines@aol.comh8spam (Palms2pines) wrote in message news:<20040108145445.07996.00002439@mb-m16.aol.com>... >IMO, People go the embryo route because the idea of an already born human >squicks them for some reason. It's not really theirs. > >Marley > Marley, people go the embryo route for the same reasons many spend huge bucks on other fertility treatments; because experiencing a pregnancy is *very, very* important to them. I do know some women who are as interested in experiencing pregnancy as they are raising children. Most of these women (couples) are not interested in adopting. It is just not the journey they seek. I seriously cannot imagine your feeling scorn for them. Why would anyone? There is nothing at all wrong with wanting to be pregnant and wanting it very, very much. > > I've met a couple of women who just *love* being pregnant. They crave the 'experience' of pregnancy for it's *own* sake. They say they like the plenitude, that it makes them feel all warm and glowy. I must say they do seem to be able to just about tolerate the resulting kids, but the main point for them seems to be 'being' pregnant. We had a grad student like that. By the time she had her doctorate she had 4 kids and 3 husbands. Marriage #2 ended when she learned Hubbykins put pictures of her in some amateur porn magazine. The other day I met an 'educated' woman (masters in history) who was pregnant with her 10th (eeek!) child. She seemed complacent, though not particularly happy. She said she adored being pregnant, that it made her feel significant. Yikes. I suppose it's a good thing then that she can procreate, since if she couldn't she'd be invisible at best. I suppose the resultant kids grow up, pursue the same ignis fatuous (search for meaning) . . . and so on, ad infinitum. I'd be suprrised if they have big famlies of their own. By bgrandmother came from a family of 10 or 11. All of them had small families. My bgrandmother had 1 kid (my bmom) who was born 9 months and 2 days afterthe wedding. Did the Dionne's have any kids amongst them?



You're probably right.
Sort of aversion therapy.
Re. the Dionne quints, I don't know. I don't think any of them did
have kids, but I could be wrong about that.
I know they were mercilessly exploited, and that Dionne quints paper
dress-up dollies are much prized collectables in some circles (not
mine, needless to say)
There's a book by Pierre Burton about them. If I'm down the library
this weekend I'll check it out.


Rh.



Some (people like Marley, and my friends N and D) break the cycle. Of course, it avails them nout. A Hobson's choice. Rh (bleak, but cheery) Marley a personal choice. Why bother criticizing? P2P

palms2pines@aol.comh8spam (Palms2pines) wrote in message news:<20040108144954.07996.00002438@mb-m16.aol.com>...The reason infant adoption became de rigeur was to give childlesscouple the experience of raising an infant birth. The only differencewas not going through the birth canal. And the medical professionwould tell them that when advising them to adopt once all fertiltytreatment failed.Anyone can read that old literature in any Medical Journal and theolder adoption agency material. It's hardly new news.Di You're a hoot, Di. I'll bet I can find an old medical journal that also recommends blood letting. I could probably find one that recommends a wide variety of things we would find hilarious today. What is your point about old medical journals? Do you have a point?
Come on P2P. Stop pulling your own leg.

Di


P2P

>Subject: Re: More on embryo adoption--the best form of adoptionFrom: patrice68@bigpond.com.au (Dian)Date: 1/10/04 7:07 AM Pacific Standard TimeMessage-id: <c599139c.0401100707.6536a3e4@posting.google.com>palms2pines@aol.comh8spam (Palms2pines) wrote in messagenews:<20040108144954.07996.00002438@mb-m16.aol.com>...The reason infant adoption became de rigeur was to give childlesscouple the experience of raising an infant birth. The only differencewas not going through the birth canal. And the medical professionwould tell them that when advising them to adopt once all fertiltytreatment failed.Anyone can read that old literature in any Medical Journal and theolder adoption agency material. It's hardly new news.Di You're a hoot, Di. I'll bet I can find an old medical journal that also recommends blood letting. I could probably find one that recommends a wide variety of things we would find hilarious today. What is your point aboutold medical journals? Do you have a point?Come on P2P. Stop pulling your own leg.Di

Beats you that continues to pull old wive's tales out of your big bumm.




Diane Welfare, "she describes the US market as a "$US1.4 billion business in
baby trafficking". ~~121603
http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2003/12/15/1071336884771.html

>What is your point about old medical journals? Do you have a point?Come on P2P. Stop pulling your own leg.Di


Some answer. Did you have a point about old medical journals? What is
interesting or relevant about your assertion some of them claim adopting a
child will help a couple with fertility challenges relax (that alone is
bizarre) and get pregnant? Are you holding this up as proof of something? If
so, what?


P2P