Alan Pollock wrote:
I hope my personal recollection can help. Very shortly after the 9/11 attacks, US network television news started reporting that the terrorists had slipped into the US from Canada early on the morning of the 11th. Some were said to have taken the ferry across from Nova Scotia while others drover over the border from southern Ontario. It was later revealed that they had not come from Canada at all, but had been in the US for a considerable period of time. On the other hand there have been documented cases of terrorists from Canada coming into the US in the recent past. So don't give the wrong impression here. There are good reasons to be vigilant, while there's no reason to stereotype or generalize. Nex

What documented evidence is that? I don't dispute that there have been terrorists
in Canada. We had our own experiences with the FLQ, and the people responsible for
the Air India bombings operated out of Canada. I don't know of any incidents of
Canadian based terrorists conducting operations in the US. However, the OP was about
the press releases that came out almost immediately after the 9/11 attacks that
claimed that some of the hijackers had slipped in from Canada the night before. The
truth came out later that they had all come directly to the US, had been there for
some time, and one had even had his visa renewed while he was there.

In rec.travel.usa-canada Dave Smith <adavid.smith@sympatico.ca> wrote: What documented evidence is that? I don't dispute that there have been terrorists in Canada. We had our own experiences with the FLQ, and the people responsible for the Air India bombings operated out of Canada. I don't know of any incidents of Canadian based terrorists conducting operations in the US. However, the OP was about the press releases that came out almost immediately after the 9/11 attacks that claimed that some of the hijackers had slipped in from Canada the night before. The truth came out later that they had all come directly to the US, had been there for some time, and one had even had his visa renewed while he was there.


I'm surprised you haven't heard of, for instance, Ahmed Ressam in '99.

Google it. In the meantime:

http://abcnews.go.com/sections/us/DailyNews/canada991221a.html

A quote from the article:

"The Globe and Mail, an Ontario newspaper, reports that Canada granted a
passport to Ahmed Ressam, 32, who was arrested at a border checkpoint last
week. Ressam was issued the passport under a false name using a Quebec
baptismal certificate.
Canada granted the document to Ressam last February, the paper reported,
even though he had been arrested for theft months before, had ties to
suspected terrorists and his fingerprints were known to authorities.
The Globe and Mail story, which cited unidentified sources, says that
Ressam "duped" the Canadians.
In Quebec, background checks are not required to obtain a passport and the
only proof of citizenship needed is a baptismal certificate, which authorities
say Rassam forged, using the name Benni Noris.
Since Ressam's arrest last Tuesday, international scrutiny has focused on
Canada as a potential haven for terrorist groups. Members of at least 50 known
terrorist groups are believed to be present there because they face fewer
legal restrictions than in the United States.
Ressam was charged Friday with bringing nitroglycerine into the United
States, having false ID and making false statements to U.S. Customs officials.
He could be indicted by a secret grand jury in U.S. District Court in Seattle
as soon as today, according to news reports."

End of Quote


And so on.

And more generally, a Dutch rag says:

http://www.rnw.nl/hotspots/html/canada010921.html

"The terrorist attacks on the US have struck a nerve in neighbouring Canada. A
man arrested by the FBI in Chicago in connection with the attacks had lived in
Toronto for six years and Canadian police say they had been trying to track
him down. The arrest of the man is somewhat of an embarrassment for the
Canadian authorities. It's sparked new debate about the country's widely
criticised security and immigration service."

And on and on. Everywhere criticism of Canadian sloppiness in implementing
already questionable Immigration policies.

In 1998, the CSIS stated that:

"Most of the world's terrorist groups have established themselves in Canada,
seeking safe haven, setting up operational bases, and attempting to gain
access to the USA.... [These groups] follow a familiar pattern of behaviour of
.... making fraudulent use of false or valid travel documentation [and]
arranging the illegal transit of members to the United States and other
countries."


I didn't want to quote any of this - I'm not the quoter type. But you asked so
nicely. (cough)


My conclusion is that we have two seperate items:

- a few silly and erroneous news reports, and

- the dismal state of Canadian Immigration policies and implemantation which
are even worse than the ones in the US, incredible as that may seem.

One does not invalidate the other, no matter how hard one tries. Nex

In article <bdofv3$kbh$1@reader1.panix.com>,
Alan Pollock <nex@nopanix.com> wrote:
A quote from the article: "The Globe and Mail, an Ontario newspaper, reports that Canada granted a passport to Ahmed Ressam, 32, who was arrested at a border checkpoint last week. Ressam was issued the passport under a false name using a Quebec baptismal certificate.

He was CAUGHT, for heaven's sake! By the Amurcan authorities! Why
couldn't they catch those guys who crashed planes into buildings, who
DIDN'T come through Canada?
"The terrorist attacks on the US have struck a nerve in neighbouring Canada.

So the Canadians are looking. How does that make them undesirable to the
US?

In rec.travel.usa-canada Dave Smith <adavid.smith@sympatico.ca> wrote: Alan Pollock wrote:
I'm surprised you haven't heard of, for instance, Ahmed Ressam in '99. Google it. In the meantime:
I do recall that one. It caused quite a commotion here because we were accused of being slack about terrorists and illegal immigrants. I figured that we were not told the whole story, and that his capture at the US border was more than just luck on the part of US border guards. His illegal activities in Canada were relatively minor, and we would have been stuck with dealing with the guy. I have no doubt that Canadian enforcement agencies had him under surveillance and dropped a dime on him when he headed for the US where he would be facing the more serious charges. We did the US and ourselves a favour by setting him up at the US border.


Nice theory, which seeks to make Canada look squeaky clean. That's the problem
in a nutshell. Canada can do no wrong. Balderdash. And with an attitude like
that, how can anything get better?

I argued for reasonableness in this thread by saying that despite a few
instances it doesn't do to stereotype and generalize about Canada in the vague
manner that first poster so ridiculously did.

Look at the responses. Accusations against the US, defensive assertions that
nothing's wrong in Canada, and name-calling.

Not helpful and a lot more revealing that anyone would care to admit.

Yawn. Now how does that go again? Oh right. One cannot criticise anything
Canadian under pain of being nitpicked to death, yet one can criticise
anything American and usually get about 50% of participating Americans to
agree.

To me, that says a lot, all of it flattering to Americans. Nex

In rec.travel.usa-canada Dave Smith <adavid.smith@sympatico.ca> wrote: Alan Pollock wrote:
been stuck with dealing with the guy. I have no doubt that Canadian enforcement agencies had him under surveillance and dropped a dime on him when he headed for the US where he would be facing the more serious charges. We did the US and ourselves a favour by setting him up at the US border. Nice theory, which seeks to make Canada look squeaky clean. That's the problem in a nutshell. Canada can do no wrong. Balderdash. And with an attitude like that, how can anything get better?
I guess that you prefer to believe that US border people just happened to catch this guy through their vigilance.
I argued for reasonableness in this thread by saying that despite a few instances it doesn't do to stereotype and generalize about Canada in the vague manner that first poster so ridiculously did.
The OP was wondering about the origin of the "urban myth" that the 9/11 attackers had been allowed into Canada and then into the US. The fact is that they did not come through Canada, but had entered the US directly. Moreover, Canada did not allow them into the US. Even if they had come in through Canada, it was still American authorities who allowed them into the US. It was American aviation schools who trained them to fly.


Read the thread. Nex

Alan, PLEASE rwead my OP and my final today - after i found the information i needed. John Ashcroft
told it the way all Canadians and US citizens hoped it would be: the Canada-US border IS secure. It
is MORE secure than before.

regards.

Ken in Winnipeg, Canada

Alan Pollock wrote:
Read the thread. Nex