PDA

View Full Version : No pay for training


jerms93
08-02-2004, 07:24 AM
My wife recently had a mandatory training session on a Saturday after working 42 hours that week. The training was for a skill required for her job. She put the 8 hours on her time card but was told that the training was not paid. Is this correct that you can be required to attend a training session and not be paid for it?

Sue
08-02-2004, 08:26 AM
My wife recently had a mandatory training session on a Saturday after working 42 hours that week. The training was for a skill required for her job. She put the 8 hours on her time card but was told that the training was not paid. Is this correct that you can be required to attend a training session and not be paid for it?


Federal Law states that an hourly employee must be paid for any hours over 40 in one work week at 1.5 times their base hourly rate. If your wife clocked in, she was on company time/payroll.

Was she told upfront that it would be a non paid session and not to clock in?

Is she hourly or salary?

jerms93
08-03-2004, 07:02 AM
No, she was not told the training was un-paid until she turned in her timecard. When her boss told her of the meeting, it was said, "We have a meeting here on Saturday, your attendance is required." She is an hourly employee. I have been told that because she works for such a small business (less than 8 employees) they may not be required to pay overtime. Is this correct?

LConnell
08-03-2004, 03:27 PM
What state are you in? Many states have minimum wage laws that supplement or supercede the federal laws.

Sue
08-03-2004, 03:30 PM
No, she was not told the training was un-paid until she turned in her timecard. When her boss told her of the meeting, it was said, "We have a meeting here on Saturday, your attendance is required." She is an hourly employee. I have been told that because she works for such a small business (less than 8 employees) they may not be required to pay overtime. Is this correct?


How small is the company? I called the Labor Board and they told me that even small businesses are subject to the Federal Labor Standards Act that governs overtime and minimum wage requirements and more.
I would suggest contacting your local Department of Labor and getting specifics, since I could not get any over the phone.
Keep me posted.
Sue

LConnell
08-03-2004, 03:43 PM
Nearly every business in the US is subject to minimum wage laws because the requirements are so broad. For example, requirements include $500,000 worth of business AND/OR participating in interstate commerce or producing goods that may be used in interstate commerce. So, if an employer is receiving or selling products for sale or use that come from or are to be used in another state, the employer is participating in interstate commerce.

In addition, as stated earlier, several states have laws that expands the definition of covered employers.

Chances are great that her employer is subject to minimum wage laws.

jerms93
08-09-2004, 07:26 AM
The business my wife works for is a church-established Preschool in Kansas. Right now, there are 5 employees. Does the fact that it is a church make a difference? My wife said it might.

LConnell
08-09-2004, 10:29 AM
Churches are not exempt from coverage. Also, while on the surface, it may appear that your wife is not engaged in interstate commerce, courts have said that if the center uses toilet paper, light bulbs, etc., that have been manufactured and then shipped from another state, it is considered as participating in interstate commerce.

Therefore, your wife is covered by the Act.

jerms93
08-17-2004, 10:07 PM
Am I correct in understanding that if my wife is to attend training sessions on Saturdays, it is required she be paid for it either with a training rate or overtime? She has been told that she has to have a certain number of hours spent in training yearly in order to keep her job. These are the Saturday training sessions in question. I'm sure this sounds redundant however, I want to make sure we have our facts straight. Also, if the training is at a site away from her normal work facility, would her employer have to pay mileage expenses for her travel?

LConnell
08-17-2004, 10:25 PM
In order for time spent at training NOT to be considered work time (and, therefore, not compensated), it must meet the following four requirements.

1) Attendance is outside of the employee's regular working hours
2) Attendance must be voluntary
3) The employee must not do any productive work while attending and
4) The training should not be directly related to the employee's job. It is considered as directly related if it helps the employee in handling his or her present job better (as opposed to training for a future job).

Since the class is mandatory and is job-related, it must be considered as work time, and, therefore, it must be paid.

An exceptioin is when training is offered by bona fide independent institutions, such as CPR classes for ambulence personnel or training that is required by the state, such as ongoing training for nurses, but only if that training is not specifically tailored to meet the needs of the employer.

Let me know if you have other questions.

Sue
08-18-2004, 08:43 AM
Am I correct in understanding that if my wife is to attend training sessions on Saturdays, it is required she be paid for it either with a training rate or overtime? She has been told that she has to have a certain number of hours spent in training yearly in order to keep her job. These are the Saturday training sessions in question. I'm sure this sounds redundant however, I want to make sure we have our facts straight. Also, if the training is at a site away from her normal work facility, would her employer have to pay mileage expenses for her travel?

I think we need to go back and clarify if your wife's company qualifies for the FSLA laws on wages as stated below:

Broadly, employees working for the types of companies and organizations below, whether for-profit or non-profit, are eligible.

* Any that gross $500,000 or more annually
* Any engaged in interstate commerce
* Federal, state and local government agencies
* Hospitals and institutions engaged in the care of sick, aged or mentally-ill people
* Educational institutions including preschools


But there are other determining factors. For details, start with Who is Covered? from the Department of Labor.

http://jobsearchtech.about.com/gi/dynamic/offsite.htm?site=http://www.dol.gov/esa/regs/compliance/whd/hrg.htm%232

Please review the above information and visit the site above so you can determine this.

Thanks
Sue

LConnell
08-18-2004, 09:25 AM
It's hard to imagine a business that would not qualify. The reason is that the interpretation of interstate commerce is very broad. For example, if the business uses products that come from out-of-state, such as paper, pencils, etc., it is considered as participating in interstate commerce.

Sue
08-18-2004, 09:41 AM
It's hard to imagine a business that would not qualify. The reason is that the interpretation of interstate commerce is very broad. For example, if the business uses products that come from out-of-state, such as paper, pencils, etc., it is considered as participating in interstate commerce.

I agree, but with only 8 employees, they may get all their supplies in town. i have worked for such places before. Many small towns never do any business outside their zip codes.

LConnell
08-18-2004, 10:07 AM
I'm from a small town, as well. On point, the DOL has stated that if their supplies were made elsewhere, it is considered as interstate commerce.

A covered enterprise is defined under the act under a two-part test (29 U.S.C. 203 (r) (l) and 203 (s) (l). The test asks:

1) Does the employer have two or more "employers engaged in commerce or in the production of goods for commerce, or employees handling, selling or otherwise working on goods or materials that have been move or produced for commerce by any person"; and

2) Does the employer have a gross annual volum of sales of not less than $500,000, unless working in an enterprise not subject to the dollar value test?

Such enterprises include places such as those engaged in the operation of a hospital, an institution primarily engaged in the care of the sick, aged, etc. or a school. Another exemption is a family business (where the business only employes family members). Interestingly, employers who are in the business of laundering, cleaning or repairing clothing or fabrics are exempt from only some of the requirements of FLSA. They are not exempt from child labor provisions and their is a minimum overtime pay requirement.

Case law specifically lists examples of interstate commerce. It includes circumstances such as a rest home where the employees handled patient care products that were produced out of state; janitors who handled toilet paper that was produced out of state; trash handlers who hauled waste away from a covered enterprise; gasoline attendants who sold gasoline that have been moved from out of state; security guards of a facility that used products that came from out of state (unless the guards are only there to guard the employees of the facility and are operating only after the facility is closed).

Wow. You can see that FLSA is very encompassing. Chances are great that a company is subject to FLSA.

Complete Labor Law Poster for $24.95
from www.LaborLawCenter.com, includes
State, Federal, & OSHA posting requirements