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penelope405
09-27-2006, 05:03 PM
I recently gave my two week notice at my job and requested the use of my sick and personal days during my last two weeks. I was told that because I had terminated my employment, I am no longer entitled to these benefits.
When exactly is my termination date? My company obviously believes (for their own greedy purposes) that I terminated my employment once I gave notice, but I maintain that I merely notified them of the date on which my employment will be terminated. Does anyone have any information on this? :confused:

robb71
09-27-2006, 05:33 PM
In most cases the termination date would equal your last day worked.

I suppose your question is "Can my employer not allow me to use my vacation and sick days during my notice?". The answer to this question will ultimately depend on company policy. At my company, we do not allow employees who have provided notice to call off sick or use vacation days. The employee must work the entire notice period in order to meet the expectations of the notice that was provided.

penelope405
09-27-2006, 05:39 PM
Our employee handbook states that we forfeit our benefits upon termination. My boss actually quoted the handbook paragraph to me to tell me I'm no longer entitled. And I know that every employer would fight this, but... I can't help but feel they're twisting words (interpreting them differently, they say) just to save themselves a few dollars. Is there a legal definition somewhere about when exactly termination of employment occurs???

ScottB
09-27-2006, 05:44 PM
Your termination date should be the last day you work. It could be the last day you are in a paid status with your employer (for example, you work one week of your two week's notice and take the last week off using accrued vacation, which is not likely to happen with most companies).

State laws vary and some require that accrued vacation be paid. Some states do not require that and you need to look at the company policies about the payment of accrued vacation. Some companies will pay it, if two weeks notice is given. Others will simply refuse to pay it at all, which is legal, if the state laws allow that. The federal laws do not address this issue.

I don't know of any states that require the payment of unused sick time (I could be mistaken -- California has weird labor laws). After all, the purpose of that leave is to give you pay when you are too sick to work. It should not be considered extra pay to be cashed in at your convenience.

ScottB
09-27-2006, 05:49 PM
Is there a legal definition somewhere about when exactly termination of employment occurs???

Likely not. You are not going to win this fight unless you can demonstrate that other employees have received vacation and sick time after giving notice.

Your soon to be ex-employer needs to revise the handbook to make it clear that accrued vacation will not be taken nor paid once an employee gives notice (if that is what they want to do and state laws allow it). I think that is a stupid policy, but some states allow it.

robb71
09-27-2006, 06:04 PM
ScottB:

To me, it sounds like the intent of the employer is that she would cover ALL her shifts during her notice period. The employer may not have positioned the explanation in the best light; but I can understand that request. If notice is given for two weeks of which she'd like to schedule accrued but unused vacation, she's really only giving notice through the start of her vacation. She's not REALLY giving two weeks notice.

For example: Let's say that the employee has 40 hours available vacation.

The employee tells the boss today that the last day is in 2 weeks (which is the requirement under company policy).

When providing notice the employee tells his boss that he wants to take 40 hours vacation on the last week of his notice.

He's not really WORKING out the notice period. He's only working out part of that time. The purpose of providing notice is to provide the employer with time to recruit and train the replacement. The departing employee hasn't allowed that to happen if allowed to use available vacation during the notice period.

I, by no means, support a forfeiture policy; but I do understand not letting an employee use available PTO during the notice period.

ScottB
09-27-2006, 06:30 PM
The purpose of providing notice is to provide the employer with time to recruit and train the replacement. The departing employee hasn't allowed that to happen if allowed to use available vacation during the notice period.

I, by no means, support a forfeiture policy; but I do understand not letting an employee use available PTO during the notice period.

Well, not just vacation, but available sick time, when the employee is not sick.

I have no idea how companies with PTO (holiday plus vacation plus sick time) work this issue, but you are correct that some companies WANT and need the employee to stay on the job until the company can find a replacement. Others, have other threads have shown, will kick the employee out the door immediately upon giving notice.

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