Illinois student sues Starbucks over spill, says cup was defective

THE ASSOCIATED PRESS

EDWARDSVILLE, Ill. -- A graduate student at Southern Illinois
University is suing Starbucks Corp., saying her hands were severely
burned when coffee spilled from a defective cup.

According to the lawsuit filed Friday by Molly Alter in Madison County
court, the cup was bent or creased, causing hot coffee to spill after
she purchased the beverage Dec. 3 at a Starbucks on campus, the
Belleville News-Democrat reported.

The lawsuit seeks damages of more than $50,000.

A Starbucks spokeswoman told the newspaper Monday that she could not
comment on the lawsuit because the company had not yet seen it.

Alter, who is studying metal smithing, had to take grades of
"incomplete" in three courses because her hands were bandaged "like
two clubs" for treatment of second-degree burns, said Matthew Marlen,
her lawyer.

"There was something wrong with the cup," Marlen said. "Somebody
should have caught that."

"Caren" <caren50@msn.com> wrote in message
news:3754f0b3.0401271050.7fcfc096@posting.google.c om... Illinois student sues Starbucks over spill, says cup was defective THE ASSOCIATED PRESS EDWARDSVILLE, Ill. -- A graduate student at Southern Illinois University is suing Starbucks Corp., saying her hands were severely burned when coffee spilled from a defective cup.

well, if the cup was truly defective, yea, she should get paid. But I don't
see how one could prove that.

JWB

You've REALLY done it now. I'm totally losing it... This REALLY pisses me
off!

Caren wrote: Illinois student sues Starbucks over spill, says cup was defective THE ASSOCIATED PRESS EDWARDSVILLE, Ill. -- A graduate student at Southern Illinois University is suing Starbucks Corp., saying her hands were severely burned when coffee spilled from a defective cup. According to the lawsuit filed Friday by Molly Alter in Madison County court, the cup was bent or creased, causing hot coffee to spill after she purchased the beverage Dec. 3 at a Starbucks on campus, the Belleville News-Democrat reported. The lawsuit seeks damages of more than $50,000. A Starbucks spokeswoman told the newspaper Monday that she could not comment on the lawsuit because the company had not yet seen it. Alter, who is studying metal smithing, had to take grades of "incomplete" in three courses because her hands were bandaged "like two clubs" for treatment of second-degree burns, said Matthew Marlen, her lawyer. "There was something wrong with the cup," Marlen said. "Somebody should have caught that."

Well, don't you think that Starbucks ought to pay up if the cup really
was defective, as the lawsuit alleges?

i

In article <3754f0b3.0401271050.7fcfc096@posting.google.com>, Caren wrote: Illinois student sues Starbucks over spill, says cup was defective THE ASSOCIATED PRESS EDWARDSVILLE, Ill. -- A graduate student at Southern Illinois University is suing Starbucks Corp., saying her hands were severely burned when coffee spilled from a defective cup. According to the lawsuit filed Friday by Molly Alter in Madison County court, the cup was bent or creased, causing hot coffee to spill after she purchased the beverage Dec. 3 at a Starbucks on campus, the Belleville News-Democrat reported. The lawsuit seeks damages of more than $50,000. A Starbucks spokeswoman told the newspaper Monday that she could not comment on the lawsuit because the company had not yet seen it. Alter, who is studying metal smithing, had to take grades of "incomplete" in three courses because her hands were bandaged "like two clubs" for treatment of second-degree burns, said Matthew Marlen, her lawyer. "There was something wrong with the cup," Marlen said. "Somebody should have caught that."

"JWB" <jwbspamnomore3333@excite.com> wrote in message news:<ZDyRb.272558$0P1.41997@twister.nyc.rr.com>... "Caren" <caren50@msn.com> wrote in message news:3754f0b3.0401271050.7fcfc096@posting.google.c om... Illinois student sues Starbucks over spill, says cup was defective THE ASSOCIATED PRESS EDWARDSVILLE, Ill. -- A graduate student at Southern Illinois University is suing Starbucks Corp., saying her hands were severely burned when coffee spilled from a defective cup. well, if the cup was truly defective, yea, she should get paid. But I don't see how one could prove that. JWB

I said: For Bill! :-)

Hmm..don't know. How about the manufacturer of the cup rather than
Starbucks?

OMG -- I read a story in our paper today that actually sent me to the
moon. :) Yesterday, a woman opened a bag of potatoes from the local
Walmart and then when she turned back around her 11 month old child was
sticking a live snake in his mouth! That came out of the bag of
potatoes apparently. Apparently enough that Walmart pulled all the
potatos off the shelf <probably since all our snakes are hibernating>.
People claimed it was a copperhead but it was probably a baby rat snake
<which is confused with copperheads to 90% of Alabamians>. Still, the
entire scenario would have freaked me out to hysterical proportions!

Would I sue Walmart? Highly doubtful -- although my husband is sick to
death of being broke because the rest of the world is getting rich off
frivolous lawsuits.

The potatoes were bagged in Houston.

amy

Ignoramus14140 wrote: Well, don't you think that Starbucks ought to pay up if the cup really was defective, as the lawsuit alleges? i In article <3754f0b3.0401271050.7fcfc096@posting.google.com>, Caren wrote: Illinois student sues Starbucks over spill, says cup was defective THE ASSOCIATED PRESS EDWARDSVILLE, Ill. -- A graduate student at Southern Illinois University is suing Starbucks Corp., saying her hands were severely burned when coffee spilled from a defective cup. According to the lawsuit filed Friday by Molly Alter in Madison County court, the cup was bent or creased, causing hot coffee to spill after she purchased the beverage Dec. 3 at a Starbucks on campus, the Belleville News-Democrat reported. The lawsuit seeks damages of more than $50,000. A Starbucks spokeswoman told the newspaper Monday that she could not comment on the lawsuit because the company had not yet seen it. Alter, who is studying metal smithing, had to take grades of "incomplete" in three courses because her hands were bandaged "like two clubs" for treatment of second-degree burns, said Matthew Marlen, her lawyer. "There was something wrong with the cup," Marlen said. "Somebody should have caught that."

"Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message
news:40172F63.FC17CE02@joimail.com...
Would I sue Walmart? Highly doubtful -- although my husband is sick to death of being broke because the rest of the world is getting rich off frivolous lawsuits.

If you're broke, others getting rich off of frivolous lawsuits is probably
not the reason.

JWB wrote: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:40172F63.FC17CE02@joimail.com... Would I sue Walmart? Highly doubtful -- although my husband is sick to death of being broke because the rest of the world is getting rich off frivolous lawsuits. If you're broke, others getting rich off of frivolous lawsuits is probably not the reason.

No ****, JWB -- it's because we have children. :)

amy

JWB wrote: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:40172F63.FC17CE02@joimail.com... Would I sue Walmart? Highly doubtful -- although my husband is sick to death of being broke because the rest of the world is getting rich off frivolous lawsuits. If you're broke, others getting rich off of frivolous lawsuits is probably not the reason.

PS. You are right ya know -- that should have said "while the rest of
the world is getting rich off frivolous lawsuits". :)

Really, it doesn't chap you *** to see people suing for every little
thing while YOUR insurances, etc go up?

Maybe I'm a little hypersensitive to THAT, too since my husband has the
possibility of getting sued by any moron that screws up on the road --
don't you know the "big truck is ALWAYS at fault" in the lawyers eyes?
Shoot, there are billboards up in town saying "Have you been in a wreck
with a big truck? Call me and I'll get you cash...." Statistically,
big trucks cause VERY FEW wrecks....but that doesn't mean we won't get
sued to high heaven because of the soccer mom on the cell phone.

amy

"Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message
news:401740FC.899B3785@joimail.com... JWB wrote: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:40172F63.FC17CE02@joimail.com... Would I sue Walmart? Highly doubtful -- although my husband is sick
to death of being broke because the rest of the world is getting rich off frivolous lawsuits. If you're broke, others getting rich off of frivolous lawsuits is
probably not the reason. No ****, JWB -- it's because we have children. :)

I know lots of people with kids who are doing just fine. Usually the problem
lies with the incoming money, not the outgoing. But we had this discussion
once already - you know I feel trucking is a lousy profession.

But yes, in agreement with your point, kids can be expensive. BTW, how many
kids do you have?

"Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message
news:401743E2.79DE090A@joimail.com... JWB wrote: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:40172F63.FC17CE02@joimail.com... Would I sue Walmart? Highly doubtful -- although my husband is sick
to death of being broke because the rest of the world is getting rich off frivolous lawsuits. If you're broke, others getting rich off of frivolous lawsuits is
probably not the reason. PS. You are right ya know -- that should have said "while the rest of the world is getting rich off frivolous lawsuits". :) Really, it doesn't chap you *** to see people suing for every little thing while YOUR insurances, etc go up?

Nah. It doesn't.

In all honesty, I personally know nobody who even knows somebody whose
cousin's stepbrother's uncle got "rich" off a lawsuit. I do know a few that
tried, and all were shot down. I honestly think this is made into a *much*
bigger deal than it truly is.

Besides, many times, "frivolous" lawsuits exposed some pretty ****ty
corporate behaviour (off the top of my head - exploding Ford Pintos, and
yes, overly hot coffee served in a drive-thru)

Maybe I'm a little hypersensitive to THAT, too since my husband has the possibility of getting sued by any moron that screws up on the road -- don't you know the "big truck is ALWAYS at fault" in the lawyers eyes? Shoot, there are billboards up in town saying "Have you been in a wreck with a big truck? Call me and I'll get you cash...." Statistically, big trucks cause VERY FEW wrecks....but that doesn't mean we won't get sued to high heaven because of the soccer mom on the cell phone.

With all due respect to your husband, I know firsthand that truckers are
nowhere near the noble knights of the road many like to think they are. I'm
sorry, anyone who willingly breaks the law and because their boss told them
too doesn't rate very high in my book (speeding, driving under the
influence, fudging logbooks, avoiding the DOT checkpoints). I realize soccer
moms and cell phones are unsafe, but a vivarin-wired trucker on his 12th
hour of driving is more lethal. There is no defense for the above-mentioned.
Grow a backbone and tell the boss the goods will get there when they get
there, at 55 mph (or whatever the speed limit is)

Amy D wrote: JWB wrote: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:40172F63.FC17CE02@joimail.com... Would I sue Walmart? Highly doubtful -- although my husband is sick to death of being broke because the rest of the world is getting rich off frivolous lawsuits. If you're broke, others getting rich off of frivolous lawsuits is probably not the reason. PS. You are right ya know -- that should have said "while the rest of the world is getting rich off frivolous lawsuits". :) Really, it doesn't chap you *** to see people suing for every little thing while YOUR insurances, etc go up?

I doubt it. There are many people of this new age generation that feel they
are *entitled* to be *protected* against *every possible thing* you can think
of!

You know, like if you walk into MacDonalds, and the floor is wet (during its
cleaning), and you slip on it, you are entitled to sue MacDonalds for your own
carelessness (aka stupidity). Because after all, you don't have to be
responsible for anything anymore! You were an "innocent victim"! Where is
my "entitlement"??

Welcome to the 21st century, my dear!
/end rant

"Bill in Co." <LostInTime@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:zHHRb.30621$zj7.22568@newsread1.news.pas.eart hlink.net...
I doubt it. There are many people of this new age generation that feel
they are *entitled* to be *protected* against *every possible thing* you can
think of!

Said through the killfile "protecting" him from me.

"JWB" <jwbspamnomore3333@excite.com> writes:
"Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:401743E2.79DE090A@joimail.com... JWB wrote: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:40172F63.FC17CE02@joimail.com... > > Would I sue Walmart? Highly doubtful -- although my husband is sick to > death of being broke because the rest of the world is getting rich off > frivolous lawsuits. > If you're broke, others getting rich off of frivolous lawsuits is probably not the reason. PS. You are right ya know -- that should have said "while the rest of the world is getting rich off frivolous lawsuits". :) Really, it doesn't chap you *** to see people suing for every little thing while YOUR insurances, etc go up? Nah. It doesn't. In all honesty, I personally know nobody who even knows somebody whose cousin's stepbrother's uncle got "rich" off a lawsuit. I do know a few that tried, and all were shot down. I honestly think this is made into a *much* bigger deal than it truly is.

I tend to agree with this as far as it goes. I think the courts do a
good job dealing with frivolous lawsuits most of the time.

There is something which I think is a problem though, which is that
often lawsuits which aren't frivolous are given really high
settlements, and other times lawsuits about technical issues (for
example medical malpractice) are decided by people without the
expertise needed to settle them.

If your baby dies during childbirth, for example, and you choose to
sue, you are fairly likely to get a settlement from the insurance
company even if no malpractice is involved. A dead babies plays well
with a jury, and insurance companies would like to avoid the risk of a
jury settlement.

And this points up the third problem: because insurance companies are
worried about large settlements, they are often willing to settle
without a trial.
Besides, many times, "frivolous" lawsuits exposed some pretty ****ty corporate behaviour (off the top of my head - exploding Ford Pintos, and yes, overly hot coffee served in a drive-thru)

Yep.
Maybe I'm a little hypersensitive to THAT, too since my husband has the possibility of getting sued by any moron that screws up on the road -- don't you know the "big truck is ALWAYS at fault" in the lawyers eyes? Shoot, there are billboards up in town saying "Have you been in a wreck with a big truck? Call me and I'll get you cash...." Statistically, big trucks cause VERY FEW wrecks....but that doesn't mean we won't get sued to high heaven because of the soccer mom on the cell phone. With all due respect to your husband, I know firsthand that truckers are nowhere near the noble knights of the road many like to think they are. I'm sorry, anyone who willingly breaks the law and because their boss told them too doesn't rate very high in my book (speeding, driving under the influence, fudging logbooks, avoiding the DOT checkpoints). I realize soccer moms and cell phones are unsafe, but a vivarin-wired trucker on his 12th hour of driving is more lethal. There is no defense for the above-mentioned. Grow a backbone and tell the boss the goods will get there when they get there, at 55 mph (or whatever the speed limit is)

And get fired for it. Well, I agree, that's what I'd do, but it
involves more than growing a backbone, it involves looking for a new
career!

My ex was an attorney with the federal government. He would come home talking
about the damnedest cases. One of the more memorable was a man suing the
government because, as he was walking through a national park with hot springs,
his dog (who was unleashed) dug under a fence that was around a hot spring and
went into the water, and started yelping because the hot springs was... well,
hot. The man climbed the fence, and dove into the water to save the dog. The
man was burned. He sued.

Now, the park service had 5 or 6 foot fences. The dog was unleashed on federal
grounds (illegal). But, the cost of going to a trial, and knowing here was
this poor burned guy who *only* wanted to save his dog (I can't remember what
happened to the dog... will have to ask) the feds settled with the man.

Sorry, Bill.... <giggle>

Sheila

JWB wrote: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:401740FC.899B3785@joimail.com... JWB wrote: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:40172F63.FC17CE02@joimail.com... > > Would I sue Walmart? Highly doubtful -- although my husband is sick to > death of being broke because the rest of the world is getting rich off > frivolous lawsuits. > If you're broke, others getting rich off of frivolous lawsuits is probably not the reason. No ****, JWB -- it's because we have children. :) I know lots of people with kids who are doing just fine. Usually the problem lies with the incoming money, not the outgoing. But we had this discussion once already - you know I feel trucking is a lousy profession. But yes, in agreement with your point, kids can be expensive. BTW, how many kids do you have?

Two kids.

Trucking in itself isn't a lousy profession. And it's an absolutely
necessary profession. I always get that "you are looking down your nose
at the little people who make sure you have Charmin to wipe your
precious little tush" feeling when you and I talk trucking. :) Although
I know that isn't the case. :)

amy

amy

JWB wrote: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:401743E2.79DE090A@joimail.com... JWB wrote: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:40172F63.FC17CE02@joimail.com... > > Would I sue Walmart? Highly doubtful -- although my husband is sick to > death of being broke because the rest of the world is getting rich off > frivolous lawsuits. > If you're broke, others getting rich off of frivolous lawsuits is probably not the reason. PS. You are right ya know -- that should have said "while the rest of the world is getting rich off frivolous lawsuits". :) Really, it doesn't chap you *** to see people suing for every little thing while YOUR insurances, etc go up? Nah. It doesn't. In all honesty, I personally know nobody who even knows somebody whose cousin's stepbrother's uncle got "rich" off a lawsuit. I do know a few that tried, and all were shot down. I honestly think this is made into a *much* bigger deal than it truly is. Besides, many times, "frivolous" lawsuits exposed some pretty ****ty corporate behaviour (off the top of my head - exploding Ford Pintos, and yes, overly hot coffee served in a drive-thru) Maybe I'm a little hypersensitive to THAT, too since my husband has the possibility of getting sued by any moron that screws up on the road -- don't you know the "big truck is ALWAYS at fault" in the lawyers eyes? Shoot, there are billboards up in town saying "Have you been in a wreck with a big truck? Call me and I'll get you cash...." Statistically, big trucks cause VERY FEW wrecks....but that doesn't mean we won't get sued to high heaven because of the soccer mom on the cell phone. With all due respect to your husband, I know firsthand that truckers are nowhere near the noble knights of the road many like to think they are. I'm sorry, anyone who willingly breaks the law and because their boss told them too doesn't rate very high in my book (speeding, driving under the influence, fudging logbooks, avoiding the DOT checkpoints). I realize soccer moms and cell phones are unsafe, but a vivarin-wired trucker on his 12th hour of driving is more lethal. There is no defense for the above-mentioned. Grow a backbone and tell the boss the goods will get there when they get there, at 55 mph (or whatever the speed limit is)

JWB, that is the media version and not reality. If you really want
statistics of what you are talking about they are out there. Yes, there
are problem children in the industry <just as among doctors, shrinks,
lawyers>. I detest the idiots in big trucks as much as you do and
report them every time one rides my bumper or does something stupid on
the road. I challenge you to spend a week in a truck to actually see
reality. I'd probably even donate a truck and chauffer for your search
for reality.

amy

JWB wrote: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:401743E2.79DE090A@joimail.com... JWB wrote: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:40172F63.FC17CE02@joimail.com... > > Would I sue Walmart? Highly doubtful -- although my husband is sick to > death of being broke because the rest of the world is getting rich off > frivolous lawsuits. > If you're broke, others getting rich off of frivolous lawsuits is probably not the reason. PS. You are right ya know -- that should have said "while the rest of the world is getting rich off frivolous lawsuits". :) Really, it doesn't chap you *** to see people suing for every little thing while YOUR insurances, etc go up? Nah. It doesn't. In all honesty, I personally know nobody who even knows somebody whose cousin's stepbrother's uncle got "rich" off a lawsuit. I do know a few that tried, and all were shot down. I honestly think this is made into a *much* bigger deal than it truly is. Besides, many times, "frivolous" lawsuits exposed some pretty ****ty corporate behaviour (off the top of my head - exploding Ford Pintos, and yes, overly hot coffee served in a drive-thru) Maybe I'm a little hypersensitive to THAT, too since my husband has the possibility of getting sued by any moron that screws up on the road -- don't you know the "big truck is ALWAYS at fault" in the lawyers eyes? Shoot, there are billboards up in town saying "Have you been in a wreck with a big truck? Call me and I'll get you cash...." Statistically, big trucks cause VERY FEW wrecks....but that doesn't mean we won't get sued to high heaven because of the soccer mom on the cell phone. With all due respect to your husband, I know firsthand that truckers are nowhere near the noble knights of the road many like to think they are. I'm sorry, anyone who willingly breaks the law and because their boss told them too doesn't rate very high in my book (speeding, driving under the influence, fudging logbooks, avoiding the DOT checkpoints). I realize soccer moms and cell phones are unsafe, but a vivarin-wired trucker on his 12th hour of driving is more lethal. There is no defense for the above-mentioned. Grow a backbone and tell the boss the goods will get there when they get there, at 55 mph (or whatever the speed limit is)

PS. If you actually DO go looking for statistics check your sources
very carefully. Many "get rid of evil truck" groups lump Bubba's pickup
TRUCK in the statistics.

amy

Amy D (amykae@joimail.com) writes: JWB wrote: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:40172F63.FC17CE02@joimail.com... Would I sue Walmart? Highly doubtful -- although my husband is sick to death of being broke because the rest of the world is getting rich off frivolous lawsuits. If you're broke, others getting rich off of frivolous lawsuits is probably not the reason. PS. You are right ya know -- that should have said "while the rest of the world is getting rich off frivolous lawsuits". :) Really, it doesn't chap you *** to see people suing for every little thing while YOUR insurances, etc go up?

Sure.
Maybe I'm a little hypersensitive to THAT, too since my husband has the possibility of getting sued by any moron that screws up on the road -- don't you know the "big truck is ALWAYS at fault" in the lawyers eyes? Shoot, there are billboards up in town saying "Have you been in a wreck with a big truck? Call me and I'll get you cash...." Statistically, big trucks cause VERY FEW wrecks....but that doesn't mean we won't get sued to high heaven because of the soccer mom on the cell phone.

Well, thats what insurance is for ?

And, the flip side of it is that, a driver of another car, whose
curb weight is roughly comparable to that of one's own car, when
such a vehicle and yours share an incident, there is no disparity
of impact.

But, when a huge truck ( Far too many of them on the roads for
my driving safety comforts ) and a car mix it up, the truck
tends to be nearly unscathed, while the car and drive of it,
get demolished.

And, I've had a few times when an 18 wheeler was doing **** that
caused me to have to evade his looniness.

Andre

--
" I'm a man... But, I can change... If I have to... I guess. "
The Man Prayer, Red Green.

JWB wrote: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:401743E2.79DE090A@joimail.com... JWB wrote: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:40172F63.FC17CE02@joimail.com... > > Would I sue Walmart? Highly doubtful -- although my husband is sick to > death of being broke because the rest of the world is getting rich off > frivolous lawsuits. > If you're broke, others getting rich off of frivolous lawsuits is probably not the reason. PS. You are right ya know -- that should have said "while the rest of the world is getting rich off frivolous lawsuits". :) Really, it doesn't chap you *** to see people suing for every little thing while YOUR insurances, etc go up? Nah. It doesn't. In all honesty, I personally know nobody who even knows somebody whose cousin's stepbrother's uncle got "rich" off a lawsuit. I do know a few that tried, and all were shot down. I honestly think this is made into a *much* bigger deal than it truly is. Besides, many times, "frivolous" lawsuits exposed some pretty ****ty corporate behaviour (off the top of my head - exploding Ford Pintos, and yes, overly hot coffee served in a drive-thru) Maybe I'm a little hypersensitive to THAT, too since my husband has the possibility of getting sued by any moron that screws up on the road -- don't you know the "big truck is ALWAYS at fault" in the lawyers eyes? Shoot, there are billboards up in town saying "Have you been in a wreck with a big truck? Call me and I'll get you cash...." Statistically, big trucks cause VERY FEW wrecks....but that doesn't mean we won't get sued to high heaven because of the soccer mom on the cell phone. With all due respect to your husband, I know firsthand that truckers are nowhere near the noble knights of the road many like to think they are. I'm sorry, anyone who willingly breaks the law and because their boss told them too doesn't rate very high in my book (speeding, driving under the influence, fudging logbooks, avoiding the DOT checkpoints). I realize soccer moms and cell phones are unsafe, but a vivarin-wired trucker on his 12th hour of driving is more lethal. There is no defense for the above-mentioned. Grow a backbone and tell the boss the goods will get there when they get there, at 55 mph (or whatever the speed limit is)

PS. If you actually DO go looking for statistics check your sources
very carefully. Many "get rid of evil truck" groups lump Bubba's pickup
TRUCK in the statistics.

The general public is so misinformed. For example, nowadays I normally
ignore public misconceptions of the industry, but I did have to raise
heck with the local Fox news station one day. They flashed a picture of
a big truck and had a little blurb about how a truck rammed into a house
<and flashed a picture of a little suburban neighborhood> and went to a
commercial break. I'm thinking good god, how could an idiot in a big
truck be going so fast as to ram a truck into a house in a little
residential neighborhood. When they came back from the commercial break
it was a drunk Bubba's pickup truck. But you know what everyone else
who flipped the channel during the commercial assumed? Same thing I
did.

Yesterday's newspaper had a headline "Truck hits woman in wheelchair".
What would your first assumption be? Again, it was Bubba's pickup
truck...

Even SUV's are classified as "trucks" sometimes -- which REALLY skews
statistics.....

amy

LOL--sorry about that double post. I have NO CLUE how I did that. :)

amy

Amy D wrote: JWB wrote: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:401743E2.79DE090A@joimail.com... JWB wrote: > > "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message > news:40172F63.FC17CE02@joimail.com... > > > > > Would I sue Walmart? Highly doubtful -- although my husband is sick to > > death of being broke because the rest of the world is getting rich off > > frivolous lawsuits. > > > > If you're broke, others getting rich off of frivolous lawsuits is probably > not the reason. PS. You are right ya know -- that should have said "while the rest of the world is getting rich off frivolous lawsuits". :) Really, it doesn't chap you *** to see people suing for every little thing while YOUR insurances, etc go up? Nah. It doesn't. In all honesty, I personally know nobody who even knows somebody whose cousin's stepbrother's uncle got "rich" off a lawsuit. I do know a few that tried, and all were shot down. I honestly think this is made into a *much* bigger deal than it truly is. Besides, many times, "frivolous" lawsuits exposed some pretty ****ty corporate behaviour (off the top of my head - exploding Ford Pintos, and yes, overly hot coffee served in a drive-thru) Maybe I'm a little hypersensitive to THAT, too since my husband has the possibility of getting sued by any moron that screws up on the road -- don't you know the "big truck is ALWAYS at fault" in the lawyers eyes? Shoot, there are billboards up in town saying "Have you been in a wreck with a big truck? Call me and I'll get you cash...." Statistically, big trucks cause VERY FEW wrecks....but that doesn't mean we won't get sued to high heaven because of the soccer mom on the cell phone. With all due respect to your husband, I know firsthand that truckers are nowhere near the noble knights of the road many like to think they are. I'm sorry, anyone who willingly breaks the law and because their boss told them too doesn't rate very high in my book (speeding, driving under the influence, fudging logbooks, avoiding the DOT checkpoints). I realize soccer moms and cell phones are unsafe, but a vivarin-wired trucker on his 12th hour of driving is more lethal. There is no defense for the above-mentioned. Grow a backbone and tell the boss the goods will get there when they get there, at 55 mph (or whatever the speed limit is) PS. If you actually DO go looking for statistics check your sources very carefully. Many "get rid of evil truck" groups lump Bubba's pickup TRUCK in the statistics. The general public is so misinformed. For example, nowadays I normally ignore public misconceptions of the industry, but I did have to raise heck with the local Fox news station one day. They flashed a picture of a big truck and had a little blurb about how a truck rammed into a house <and flashed a picture of a little suburban neighborhood> and went to a commercial break. I'm thinking good god, how could an idiot in a big truck be going so fast as to ram a truck into a house in a little residential neighborhood. When they came back from the commercial break it was a drunk Bubba's pickup truck. But you know what everyone else who flipped the channel during the commercial assumed? Same thing I did. Yesterday's newspaper had a headline "Truck hits woman in wheelchair". What would your first assumption be? Again, it was Bubba's pickup truck... Even SUV's are classified as "trucks" sometimes -- which REALLY skews statistics..... amy

Doug Anderson wrote: "JWB" <jwbspamnomore3333@excite.com> writes: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:401743E2.79DE090A@joimail.com... JWB wrote: > > "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message > news:40172F63.FC17CE02@joimail.com... > > > > > Would I sue Walmart? Highly doubtful -- although my husband is sick to > > death of being broke because the rest of the world is getting rich off > > frivolous lawsuits. > > > > If you're broke, others getting rich off of frivolous lawsuits is probably > not the reason. PS. You are right ya know -- that should have said "while the rest of the world is getting rich off frivolous lawsuits". :) Really, it doesn't chap you *** to see people suing for every little thing while YOUR insurances, etc go up? Nah. It doesn't. In all honesty, I personally know nobody who even knows somebody whose cousin's stepbrother's uncle got "rich" off a lawsuit. I do know a few that tried, and all were shot down. I honestly think this is made into a *much* bigger deal than it truly is. I tend to agree with this as far as it goes. I think the courts do a good job dealing with frivolous lawsuits most of the time. There is something which I think is a problem though, which is that often lawsuits which aren't frivolous are given really high settlements, and other times lawsuits about technical issues (for example medical malpractice) are decided by people without the expertise needed to settle them. If your baby dies during childbirth, for example, and you choose to sue, you are fairly likely to get a settlement from the insurance company even if no malpractice is involved. A dead babies plays well with a jury, and insurance companies would like to avoid the risk of a jury settlement. And this points up the third problem: because insurance companies are worried about large settlements, they are often willing to settle without a trial. Besides, many times, "frivolous" lawsuits exposed some pretty ****ty corporate behaviour (off the top of my head - exploding Ford Pintos, and yes, overly hot coffee served in a drive-thru) Yep. Maybe I'm a little hypersensitive to THAT, too since my husband has the possibility of getting sued by any moron that screws up on the road -- don't you know the "big truck is ALWAYS at fault" in the lawyers eyes? Shoot, there are billboards up in town saying "Have you been in a wreck with a big truck? Call me and I'll get you cash...." Statistically, big trucks cause VERY FEW wrecks....but that doesn't mean we won't get sued to high heaven because of the soccer mom on the cell phone. With all due respect to your husband, I know firsthand that truckers are nowhere near the noble knights of the road many like to think they are. I'm sorry, anyone who willingly breaks the law and because their boss told them too doesn't rate very high in my book (speeding, driving under the influence, fudging logbooks, avoiding the DOT checkpoints). I realize soccer moms and cell phones are unsafe, but a vivarin-wired trucker on his 12th hour of driving is more lethal. There is no defense for the above-mentioned. Grow a backbone and tell the boss the goods will get there when they get there, at 55 mph (or whatever the speed limit is) And get fired for it. Well, I agree, that's what I'd do, but it involves more than growing a backbone, it involves looking for a new career!

The trucking industry has stellar safety records and have had fantastic
increases in safety stats the last few years. Expect that to get WORSE
with the new hours of service law put in effect January 5. Drivers are
now forced by law to drive tired <or go broke>. A truckdriver used to
have the ability to stop the truck for a nap, shower, or go eat anytime
time allowed it. NOW, they are forced to stay on the clock for 14 hours
and no more per day -- even if they are sitting at a dock for 4 hours
taking a nap they are still eating up their driving time. You will see
more truckdrivers continue to race against that 14 hour clock rather
than stop for a break. They were allowed 10 driving hours a day <no
more than 70 hours in eight days> and the driving time could be broken
up however they saw fit to safely drive. NOW, they have 11 hours to
drive a day but all "on duty" work must be performed within 14
hours--this includes fueling, loading, unloading. If you are off 34
hours the 70/8 clock resets. Sounds pretty stupid, huh?

It hasn't adversely affected us yet since we have good shippers and
receivers who don't usually hold up drivers all day but I'm afraid it's
going to have a big impact on truck safety stats.

If government wants to regulate someone they should be looking at the
culprits -- bad trucking companies, bad shippers, bad receivers.

amy

"Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message
news:4017C950.2BDCB13D@joimail.com...
JWB, that is the media version and not reality. If you really want statistics of what you are talking about they are out there. Yes, there are problem children in the industry <just as among doctors, shrinks, lawyers>. I detest the idiots in big trucks as much as you do and report them every time one rides my bumper or does something stupid on the road. I challenge you to spend a week in a truck to actually see reality. I'd probably even donate a truck and chauffer for your search for reality.

I ran a store in a Truckstop for three years. I got to know a lot of
truckers and the trucking industry very well, and have ridden with drivers
from one of our stops to another (several days travel). I realize there are
bad and good, but overall, the odds are high that truck next to you on the
road is probably being driven too fast, for too long, with a driver on
stay-awake drugs.

"Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message
news:4017CDB0.FC4EE35C@joimail.com...
Even SUV's are classified as "trucks" sometimes -- which REALLY skews statistics.....

The only stat that I'm interested in is death stats. How many truckers die
vs motorists in truck/car accidents.

The problem with these stats is they lump professionals (a trucker) with
amateurs (most of the general public). Like, I used to hear from truckers
"why not speed, everyone else does"... yea, but I'm not a paid, professional
driver driving a 30 ton vehicle. To use my behavior to justify yours (not
you, Amy) is a losing argument.

"Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message
news:4017C803.2886DDF1@joimail.com...
Trucking in itself isn't a lousy profession. And it's an absolutely necessary profession. I always get that "you are looking down your nose at the little people who make sure you have Charmin to wipe your precious little tush" feeling when you and I talk trucking. :) Although I know that isn't the case. :)

No, I don't feel that way at all. I know the profession is necessary, and
takes quite a bit of skill too.

JWB wrote: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:4017C950.2BDCB13D@joimail.com... JWB, that is the media version and not reality. If you really want statistics of what you are talking about they are out there. Yes, there are problem children in the industry <just as among doctors, shrinks, lawyers>. I detest the idiots in big trucks as much as you do and report them every time one rides my bumper or does something stupid on the road. I challenge you to spend a week in a truck to actually see reality. I'd probably even donate a truck and chauffer for your search for reality. I ran a store in a Truckstop for three years. I got to know a lot of truckers and the trucking industry very well, and have ridden with drivers from one of our stops to another (several days travel). I realize there are bad and good, but overall, the odds are high that truck next to you on the road is probably being driven too fast, for too long, with a driver on stay-awake drugs.

And the odds are higher that the car, pickup, SUV, Hummer next to you is
totally oblivious to anything outside their windshield.

amy

"Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message
news:4017E32D.334F26E2@joimail.com... JWB wrote: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:4017C950.2BDCB13D@joimail.com... JWB, that is the media version and not reality. If you really want statistics of what you are talking about they are out there. Yes,
there are problem children in the industry <just as among doctors, shrinks, lawyers>. I detest the idiots in big trucks as much as you do and report them every time one rides my bumper or does something stupid on the road. I challenge you to spend a week in a truck to actually see reality. I'd probably even donate a truck and chauffer for your
search for reality. I ran a store in a Truckstop for three years. I got to know a lot of truckers and the trucking industry very well, and have ridden with
drivers from one of our stops to another (several days travel). I realize there
are bad and good, but overall, the odds are high that truck next to you on
the road is probably being driven too fast, for too long, with a driver on stay-awake drugs. And the odds are higher that the car, pickup, SUV, Hummer next to you is totally oblivious to anything outside their windshield.

How does that justify a trucker doing what I described? Stick to trucks in
this, not cars.

Amy D <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:<40172F63.FC17CE02@joimail.com>... Hmm..don't know. How about the manufacturer of the cup rather than Starbucks? OMG -- I read a story in our paper today that actually sent me to the moon. :) Yesterday, a woman opened a bag of potatoes from the local Walmart and then when she turned back around her 11 month old child was sticking a live snake in his mouth! That came out of the bag of potatoes apparently. Apparently enough that Walmart pulled all the potatos off the shelf <probably since all our snakes are hibernating>. People claimed it was a copperhead but it was probably a baby rat snake <which is confused with copperheads to 90% of Alabamians>. Still, the entire scenario would have freaked me out to hysterical proportions! Would I sue Walmart? Highly doubtful -- although my husband is sick to death of being broke because the rest of the world is getting rich off frivolous lawsuits. The potatoes were bagged in Houston. amy

Instead of your husband being pissed at frivolous lawsuits, you might
want to stop shopping at Walmart. Lawsuits are nothing compared to
what Walmart does to communities. Talk about who is getting rich.
Walmart puts small businesses out of business any way that they can.
They pay their employees disgusting wages and refuse to unionize. If
you want to be pissed off at who is getting rich, you might want to
shop elsewhere. If you paid me to shop at Walmart, I'd decline.
Sure, the prices are great. Have you ever thought about why they're
great?

"Caren" <caren50@msn.com> wrote in message
news:3754f0b3.0401281016.2af43252@posting.google.c om... Amy D <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message
news:<40172F63.FC17CE02@joimail.com>... Hmm..don't know. How about the manufacturer of the cup rather than Starbucks? OMG -- I read a story in our paper today that actually sent me to the moon. :) Yesterday, a woman opened a bag of potatoes from the local Walmart and then when she turned back around her 11 month old child was sticking a live snake in his mouth! That came out of the bag of potatoes apparently. Apparently enough that Walmart pulled all the potatos off the shelf <probably since all our snakes are hibernating>. People claimed it was a copperhead but it was probably a baby rat snake <which is confused with copperheads to 90% of Alabamians>. Still, the entire scenario would have freaked me out to hysterical proportions! Would I sue Walmart? Highly doubtful -- although my husband is sick to death of being broke because the rest of the world is getting rich off frivolous lawsuits. The potatoes were bagged in Houston. amy Instead of your husband being pissed at frivolous lawsuits, you might want to stop shopping at Walmart. Lawsuits are nothing compared to what Walmart does to communities. Talk about who is getting rich. Walmart puts small businesses out of business any way that they can. They pay their employees disgusting wages and refuse to unionize. If you want to be pissed off at who is getting rich, you might want to shop elsewhere. If you paid me to shop at Walmart, I'd decline. Sure, the prices are great. Have you ever thought about why they're great?

Local retail business pay big bucks to cashiers and clerks? News to me. If
anything, Walmart made them raise their wages.

Many "local" businesses have a dirty store, are not open at 7pm (or 7am),
have nowhere to park, have tiny aisles where a mother and a stroller have a
hard time navigating. And you have to visit 4 of them to get what you need
from one Walmart trip.

It's my opinion that most (not all) locals who were put out of business by
Walmart deserved their fate (from a business standpoint)

For the record, I almost never shop at Walmart. It's too crowded for me. I
shop online, at Lowes, and maybe Target.

JWB

Caren <caren50@msn.com> wrote:
Instead of your husband being pissed at frivolous lawsuits, you might want to stop shopping at Walmart. Lawsuits are nothing compared to what Walmart does to communities.

Agreed. Walmart is absolutely the worst for how they treat
employees,too. I won't shop there.

By the way, Costco is much better. They start their employees at $10 an
hour and give them benefits. They have very low turnover and happy
employees. So you can still go to a big cheap store and support your
values.

JWB <jwbspamnomore3333@excite.com> wrote:
Really, it doesn't chap you *** to see people suing for every little thing while YOUR insurances, etc go up? Nah. It doesn't. In all honesty, I personally know nobody who even knows somebody whose cousin's stepbrother's uncle got "rich" off a lawsuit. I do know a few that tried, and all were shot down. I honestly think this is made into a *much* bigger deal than it truly is.


I'm with JWB. I think it is mostly urban legends.

"JWB" <jwbspamnomore3333@excite.com> wrote in message news:<CqTRb.106538$cM1.19202558@twister.nyc.rr.com>... "Caren" <caren50@msn.com> wrote in message news:3754f0b3.0401281016.2af43252@posting.google.c om... Amy D <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:<40172F63.FC17CE02@joimail.com>... Hmm..don't know. How about the manufacturer of the cup rather than Starbucks? OMG -- I read a story in our paper today that actually sent me to the moon. :) Yesterday, a woman opened a bag of potatoes from the local Walmart and then when she turned back around her 11 month old child was sticking a live snake in his mouth! That came out of the bag of potatoes apparently. Apparently enough that Walmart pulled all the potatos off the shelf <probably since all our snakes are hibernating>. People claimed it was a copperhead but it was probably a baby rat snake <which is confused with copperheads to 90% of Alabamians>. Still, the entire scenario would have freaked me out to hysterical proportions! Would I sue Walmart? Highly doubtful -- although my husband is sick to death of being broke because the rest of the world is getting rich off frivolous lawsuits. The potatoes were bagged in Houston. amy Instead of your husband being pissed at frivolous lawsuits, you might want to stop shopping at Walmart. Lawsuits are nothing compared to what Walmart does to communities. Talk about who is getting rich. Walmart puts small businesses out of business any way that they can. They pay their employees disgusting wages and refuse to unionize. If you want to be pissed off at who is getting rich, you might want to shop elsewhere. If you paid me to shop at Walmart, I'd decline. Sure, the prices are great. Have you ever thought about why they're great? Local retail business pay big bucks to cashiers and clerks? News to me. If anything, Walmart made them raise their wages. Many "local" businesses have a dirty store, are not open at 7pm (or 7am), have nowhere to park, have tiny aisles where a mother and a stroller have a hard time navigating. And you have to visit 4 of them to get what you need from one Walmart trip. It's my opinion that most (not all) locals who were put out of business by Walmart deserved their fate (from a business standpoint) For the record, I almost never shop at Walmart. It's too crowded for me. I shop online, at Lowes, and maybe Target. JWB

No, Walmart does. Many, if not most, large retailers are unionized.
Sorry, no stats here. Have you ever heard of sweatshops? Do some
research about Walmart and sweatshops. That is one reason they can
sell shirts for 5 dollars.

I don't know about your local businesses, but in this neck of the
woods, a simple coffee shop, health food store, craft store, or
whatever....but I have not noticed them being dirty. Not to mention,
any store, large or small can be dirty!!! AS far as being open from
7-7, I'd rather support a family owned business, where they work their
asses off, are kind to you, will do special things for you because
they want your business even if they were open for 5 hours a day. I
also shop or even go to doctors where I see them treating their
employees well. If see a doctor treating a nurse like they are less
than, you can bet I'll either make a call or switch doctors.

Walmart continues to spread at a rapid rate (in this area) despite the
fact that they are putting even large retailers out of business. They
have no mercy and in my opinion are far more unethical than the
frivolous lawsuits.

I also agree that I know no one, from coast to coast (friends or
family) that ever won money in a settlement of any sort. I once fell
in an alpha beta and sued them and got about 1,000 dollars which paid
for the chiropractor. That damn puddle in the middle of produce. The
worst part of it was the total embarrassment. Who cared if I broke my
leg???

Before you shop at Walmart, you ought to do a little research on the
companies practices. (not you JWB- you sit at home and have your
stuff delivered, you little prince.) :-)

"Caren" <caren50@msn.com> wrote in message
news:3754f0b3.0401281441.41967b5@posting.google.co m... "JWB" <jwbspamnomore3333@excite.com> wrote in message
news:<CqTRb.106538$cM1.19202558@twister.nyc.rr.com>... "Caren" <caren50@msn.com> wrote in message news:3754f0b3.0401281016.2af43252@posting.google.c om... Amy D <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:<40172F63.FC17CE02@joimail.com>... > Hmm..don't know. How about the manufacturer of the cup rather than > Starbucks? > > OMG -- I read a story in our paper today that actually sent me to
the > moon. :) Yesterday, a woman opened a bag of potatoes from the local > Walmart and then when she turned back around her 11 month old child
was > sticking a live snake in his mouth! That came out of the bag of > potatoes apparently. Apparently enough that Walmart pulled all the > potatos off the shelf <probably since all our snakes are
hibernating>. > People claimed it was a copperhead but it was probably a baby rat
snake > <which is confused with copperheads to 90% of Alabamians>. Still,
the > entire scenario would have freaked me out to hysterical proportions! > > Would I sue Walmart? Highly doubtful -- although my husband is sick
to > death of being broke because the rest of the world is getting rich
off > frivolous lawsuits. > > The potatoes were bagged in Houston. > > amy Instead of your husband being pissed at frivolous lawsuits, you might want to stop shopping at Walmart. Lawsuits are nothing compared to what Walmart does to communities. Talk about who is getting rich. Walmart puts small businesses out of business any way that they can. They pay their employees disgusting wages and refuse to unionize. If you want to be pissed off at who is getting rich, you might want to shop elsewhere. If you paid me to shop at Walmart, I'd decline. Sure, the prices are great. Have you ever thought about why they're great? Local retail business pay big bucks to cashiers and clerks? News to me.
If anything, Walmart made them raise their wages. Many "local" businesses have a dirty store, are not open at 7pm (or
7am), have nowhere to park, have tiny aisles where a mother and a stroller
have a hard time navigating. And you have to visit 4 of them to get what you
need from one Walmart trip. It's my opinion that most (not all) locals who were put out of business
by Walmart deserved their fate (from a business standpoint) For the record, I almost never shop at Walmart. It's too crowded for me.
I shop online, at Lowes, and maybe Target. JWB No, Walmart does. Many, if not most, large retailers are unionized.

They are?

To me, unionizing unskilled labor is a losing proposition. If you can be
easily replaced, the threat of a work stoppage holds no water. Retail is an
entry-level job at most levels. I see no need to unionize cashiers and shelf
stockers.

Sorry, no stats here. Have you ever heard of sweatshops? Do some research about Walmart and sweatshops. That is one reason they can sell shirts for 5 dollars.


and we (well, not you and I) *buy* them. But everytime you look for the
cheapest price, you are probably guilty of exploiting someone else, or
helping to eventually put someone out of business.


I don't know about your local businesses, but in this neck of the woods, a simple coffee shop, health food store, craft store, or whatever....but I have not noticed them being dirty. Not to mention, any store, large or small can be dirty!!! AS far as being open from 7-7, I'd rather support a family owned business, where they work their asses off, are kind to you, will do special things for you because they want your business even if they were open for 5 hours a day.


If they want my business, they need to be open when I want to shop.
Otherwise, they don't want it that bad.

That was always my biggest beef with family owned local businesses - they
are never open in the evening, or early. Many of them are open 9-6, no help
for someone working those hours (as many folks do)


I also shop or even go to doctors where I see them treating their employees well. If see a doctor treating a nurse like they are less than, you can bet I'll either make a call or switch doctors. Walmart continues to spread at a rapid rate (in this area) despite the fact that they are putting even large retailers out of business. They have no mercy and in my opinion are far more unethical than the frivolous lawsuits. I also agree that I know no one, from coast to coast (friends or family) that ever won money in a settlement of any sort. I once fell in an alpha beta and sued them and got about 1,000 dollars which paid for the chiropractor. That damn puddle in the middle of produce. The worst part of it was the total embarrassment. Who cared if I broke my leg???

I would care :)

Before you shop at Walmart, you ought to do a little research on the companies practices. (not you JWB- you sit at home and have your stuff delivered, you little prince.) :-)

It is nice :)

do you have a new e-mail to go with the new name? If so, e-mail it to me.

JWB wrote: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:4017E32D.334F26E2@joimail.com... JWB wrote: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:4017C950.2BDCB13D@joimail.com... > > JWB, that is the media version and not reality. If you really want > statistics of what you are talking about they are out there. Yes, there > are problem children in the industry <just as among doctors, shrinks, > lawyers>. I detest the idiots in big trucks as much as you do and > report them every time one rides my bumper or does something stupid on > the road. I challenge you to spend a week in a truck to actually see > reality. I'd probably even donate a truck and chauffer for your search > for reality. I ran a store in a Truckstop for three years. I got to know a lot of truckers and the trucking industry very well, and have ridden with drivers from one of our stops to another (several days travel). I realize there are bad and good, but overall, the odds are high that truck next to you on the road is probably being driven too fast, for too long, with a driver on stay-awake drugs. And the odds are higher that the car, pickup, SUV, Hummer next to you is totally oblivious to anything outside their windshield. How does that justify a trucker doing what I described? Stick to trucks in this, not cars.

It doesn't justify what you describe -- in fact, what you describe the
average "truckdriver" to be is so far Hollywood and out there. Okay,
let me explain -- you worked a truckstop for 3 years -- for your
information MOST seasoned, professional drivers don't spend alot of time
in a truckstop -- they are the source of fuel, food, a shower. Most
"good truckdrivers" are in and out. The ones that hang around and
converse with the truckstop help <who aren't personal friends> are
chasing lot lizards, looking for dope, are truck stop lawyers, and
generally all-round bad news. The number of them is a definite
MINORITY. And rarely, rarely will you find a truckdriver getting drunk
unless they are working for a crappy company that makes them sit at the
truckstop 3 days waiting for a load. Few are so stupid -- it only takes
blowing a .04 to get DUI in a truck -- that could be the next afternoon
after a party. And it's illegal to have alcohol <even unopened unless
it is a secure load> in a commercial vehicle although there is always
the argument that the truckstop is "private property". But the truck is
still a commercial vehicle -- if the truckstop owner gives consent the
truckdriver is done. A commercial drivers license is their sole source
of income -- few are going to risk it for a six-pack. Shoot, even when
my husband is home I drive if we have one drink at dinner -- if he blows
a .04 in a personal vehicle he still loses his commercial driver's
license.

In other words, what you encounter in the truckstop does NOT represent
the industry in any way. I worry much more about Joe Public on the
interstate than the trucks.

What you suggest would be like comparing all computer programmers to
"hackers" and "virus parents", or comparing all cops to "dirty cops", or
comparing all doctors and nurses to something such as "mercy killers" or
"abortionists" or whatever pushes your buttons, or comparing all
lawyers....okay, I'll stop there. :)

For some reason people are programmed to see the "bad" and totally miss
the concept that the "bad" which is portrayed in the media does NOT
represent the real picture. When we read it everyday in the paper that
is what we "see". Everyone <even ME> sees the asshole in the big truck
bullying in traffic -- and totally misses the 30 trucks that went by
with no incident.

amy





amy

Caren wrote: Amy D <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:<40172F63.FC17CE02@joimail.com>... Hmm..don't know. How about the manufacturer of the cup rather than Starbucks? OMG -- I read a story in our paper today that actually sent me to the moon. :) Yesterday, a woman opened a bag of potatoes from the local Walmart and then when she turned back around her 11 month old child was sticking a live snake in his mouth! That came out of the bag of potatoes apparently. Apparently enough that Walmart pulled all the potatos off the shelf <probably since all our snakes are hibernating>. People claimed it was a copperhead but it was probably a baby rat snake <which is confused with copperheads to 90% of Alabamians>. Still, the entire scenario would have freaked me out to hysterical proportions! Would I sue Walmart? Highly doubtful -- although my husband is sick to death of being broke because the rest of the world is getting rich off frivolous lawsuits. The potatoes were bagged in Houston. amy Instead of your husband being pissed at frivolous lawsuits, you might want to stop shopping at Walmart. Lawsuits are nothing compared to what Walmart does to communities. Talk about who is getting rich. Walmart puts small businesses out of business any way that they can. They pay their employees disgusting wages and refuse to unionize. If you want to be pissed off at who is getting rich, you might want to shop elsewhere. If you paid me to shop at Walmart, I'd decline. Sure, the prices are great. Have you ever thought about why they're great?

Agreed -- I stay out of Walmart if at all possible. Although the
24-hour convenience is nice in an emergency. :)

amy

"Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message
news:4018787E.348EC46F@joimail.com... JWB wrote: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:4017E32D.334F26E2@joimail.com... JWB wrote: > > "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message > news:4017C950.2BDCB13D@joimail.com... > > > > > JWB, that is the media version and not reality. If you really
want > > statistics of what you are talking about they are out there. Yes, there > > are problem children in the industry <just as among doctors,
shrinks, > > lawyers>. I detest the idiots in big trucks as much as you do and > > report them every time one rides my bumper or does something
stupid on > > the road. I challenge you to spend a week in a truck to actually
see > > reality. I'd probably even donate a truck and chauffer for your search > > for reality. > > I ran a store in a Truckstop for three years. I got to know a lot of > truckers and the trucking industry very well, and have ridden with drivers > from one of our stops to another (several days travel). I realize
there are > bad and good, but overall, the odds are high that truck next to you
on the > road is probably being driven too fast, for too long, with a driver
on > stay-awake drugs. And the odds are higher that the car, pickup, SUV, Hummer next to you
is totally oblivious to anything outside their windshield. How does that justify a trucker doing what I described? Stick to trucks
in this, not cars. It doesn't justify what you describe -- in fact, what you describe the average "truckdriver" to be is so far Hollywood and out there. Okay, let me explain -- you worked a truckstop for 3 years -- for your information MOST seasoned, professional drivers don't spend alot of time in a truckstop -- they are the source of fuel, food, a shower.

I ran the store. You know what my number one selling product was? Vivarin.
Followed by No-Doze. Followed by radar detectors.

I don't think the "average" trucker is bad. But I do think the odds are very
good that the truck next to you is driven by someone who probably is popping
uppers to stay awake, who would likely try to avoid the DOT inspection
ahead, and is speeding.


Most "good truckdrivers" are in and out. The ones that hang around and converse with the truckstop help <who aren't personal friends> are chasing lot lizards, looking for dope, are truck stop lawyers, and generally all-round bad news.


I ran into all kinds. The good and the bad. I agree the ones who "hung
around" were like you describe.


The number of them is a definite MINORITY.


This is where we disagree. They might be a minority, but I think the
minority is more like 60/40. Which is scary.


And rarely, rarely will you find a truckdriver getting drunk unless they are working for a crappy company that makes them sit at the truckstop 3 days waiting for a load. Few are so stupid -- it only takes blowing a .04 to get DUI in a truck -- that could be the next afternoon after a party. And it's illegal to have alcohol <even unopened unless it is a secure load> in a commercial vehicle although there is always the argument that the truckstop is "private property". But the truck is still a commercial vehicle -- if the truckstop owner gives consent the truckdriver is done. A commercial drivers license is their sole source of income -- few are going to risk it for a six-pack. Shoot, even when my husband is home I drive if we have one drink at dinner -- if he blows a .04 in a personal vehicle he still loses his commercial driver's license.


I never mentioned alcohol.

In other words, what you encounter in the truckstop does NOT represent the industry in any way. I worry much more about Joe Public on the interstate than the trucks.


The difference is, the truck is so much more likely to kill you than joe
public if you have a collision with it.

What you suggest would be like comparing all computer programmers to "hackers" and "virus parents", or comparing all cops to "dirty cops", or comparing all doctors and nurses to something such as "mercy killers" or "abortionists" or whatever pushes your buttons, or comparing all lawyers....okay, I'll stop there. :) For some reason people are programmed to see the "bad" and totally miss the concept that the "bad" which is portrayed in the media does NOT represent the real picture. When we read it everyday in the paper that is what we "see". Everyone <even ME> sees the asshole in the big truck bullying in traffic -- and totally misses the 30 trucks that went by with no incident.


Does your husband speed in his truck?

JWB wrote: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:4018787E.348EC46F@joimail.com... JWB wrote: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:4017E32D.334F26E2@joimail.com... > > > JWB wrote: > > > > "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message > > news:4017C950.2BDCB13D@joimail.com... > > > > > > > > JWB, that is the media version and not reality. If you really want > > > statistics of what you are talking about they are out there. Yes, there > > > are problem children in the industry <just as among doctors, shrinks, > > > lawyers>. I detest the idiots in big trucks as much as you do and > > > report them every time one rides my bumper or does something stupid on > > > the road. I challenge you to spend a week in a truck to actually see > > > reality. I'd probably even donate a truck and chauffer for your search > > > for reality. > > > > I ran a store in a Truckstop for three years. I got to know a lot of > > truckers and the trucking industry very well, and have ridden with drivers > > from one of our stops to another (several days travel). I realize there are > > bad and good, but overall, the odds are high that truck next to you on the > > road is probably being driven too fast, for too long, with a driver on > > stay-awake drugs. > > And the odds are higher that the car, pickup, SUV, Hummer next to you is > totally oblivious to anything outside their windshield. How does that justify a trucker doing what I described? Stick to trucks in this, not cars. It doesn't justify what you describe -- in fact, what you describe the average "truckdriver" to be is so far Hollywood and out there. Okay, let me explain -- you worked a truckstop for 3 years -- for your information MOST seasoned, professional drivers don't spend alot of time in a truckstop -- they are the source of fuel, food, a shower. I ran the store. You know what my number one selling product was? Vivarin. Followed by No-Doze. Followed by radar detectors. I don't think the "average" trucker is bad. But I do think the odds are very good that the truck next to you is driven by someone who probably is popping uppers to stay awake, who would likely try to avoid the DOT inspection ahead, and is speeding. Most "good truckdrivers" are in and out. The ones that hang around and converse with the truckstop help <who aren't personal friends> are chasing lot lizards, looking for dope, are truck stop lawyers, and generally all-round bad news. I ran into all kinds. The good and the bad. I agree the ones who "hung around" were like you describe. The number of them is a definite MINORITY. This is where we disagree. They might be a minority, but I think the minority is more like 60/40. Which is scary. And rarely, rarely will you find a truckdriver getting drunk unless they are working for a crappy company that makes them sit at the truckstop 3 days waiting for a load. Few are so stupid -- it only takes blowing a .04 to get DUI in a truck -- that could be the next afternoon after a party. And it's illegal to have alcohol <even unopened unless it is a secure load> in a commercial vehicle although there is always the argument that the truckstop is "private property". But the truck is still a commercial vehicle -- if the truckstop owner gives consent the truckdriver is done. A commercial drivers license is their sole source of income -- few are going to risk it for a six-pack. Shoot, even when my husband is home I drive if we have one drink at dinner -- if he blows a .04 in a personal vehicle he still loses his commercial driver's license. I never mentioned alcohol. In other words, what you encounter in the truckstop does NOT represent the industry in any way. I worry much more about Joe Public on the interstate than the trucks. The difference is, the truck is so much more likely to kill you than joe public if you have a collision with it. What you suggest would be like comparing all computer programmers to "hackers" and "virus parents", or comparing all cops to "dirty cops", or comparing all doctors and nurses to something such as "mercy killers" or "abortionists" or whatever pushes your buttons, or comparing all lawyers....okay, I'll stop there. :) For some reason people are programmed to see the "bad" and totally miss the concept that the "bad" which is portrayed in the media does NOT represent the real picture. When we read it everyday in the paper that is what we "see". Everyone <even ME> sees the asshole in the big truck bullying in traffic -- and totally misses the 30 trucks that went by with no incident. Does your husband speed in his truck?

No, he's an independent contractor so any fuel lost by speeding is money
lost. He also freezes his *** of rather than idling all night to
conserve fuel.

I think you did mention "drunk truckdrivers" in your original definition
but maybe it was someone else.

I don't think it's 60/40% but it's probably increasing as more
independent drivers get out and more big corporation <equivilant to
"sweatshops" in the walmart discussion> company drivers come in. The
big corporations recruit drivers out of areas where people are looking
for an "honest living" rather than selling crack......I know the
difference between the two just by looking at the truck and naturally
stay away from them on the road <at my husband's request>. Even though
they aren't all cracktown recruits ALOT are inexperienced.....big
companies tend to toss two rookies together in the truck hoping four
eyes are better than two.....and also own their own insurance companies.

But it's still not as BAD as portrayed.....the odds of being killed by
the other car, hummer, SUV are MUCH HIGHER.

amy

"Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message
news:401885DB.15B29184@joimail.com... JWB wrote:
Does your husband speed in his truck? No, he's an independent contractor so any fuel lost by speeding is money lost. He also freezes his *** of rather than idling all night to conserve fuel.

If he doesn't speed, he'd be the first trucker I ever saw that did not. But
I will take your word for it.

I think you did mention "drunk truckdrivers" in your original definition but maybe it was someone else.


Not I

I don't think it's 60/40% but it's probably increasing as more independent drivers get out and more big corporation <equivilant to "sweatshops" in the walmart discussion> company drivers come in. The big corporations recruit drivers out of areas where people are looking for an "honest living" rather than selling crack......I know the difference between the two just by looking at the truck and naturally stay away from them on the road <at my husband's request>. Even though they aren't all cracktown recruits ALOT are inexperienced.....big companies tend to toss two rookies together in the truck hoping four eyes are better than two.....and also own their own insurance companies. But it's still not as BAD as portrayed.....the odds of being killed by the other car, hummer, SUV are MUCH HIGHER.

I agree. But in a collision, the odds are higher of dying if you collide
with a truck.

"Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message
news:40188756.31DD06D0@joimail.com...

.. They were built for military movement then moved to commerce then the general public was allowed.


Actually, the IHS was always envisioned to be partially paid for by tolls
and gasoline taxes. Kinda silly to charge the military, right? It was not
"just" built for military movement then expanded to commerce then again to
"allow" the general public. It was built for the well being of the country,
and made sure that it was big enough to move troops. The autobahn was the
inspiration. It was never "gee, now that we have this, we should let cars on
this thing too"

But trucks pay to maintain the roads


Cars do too.


<where the hell the money goes no one knows since half the interstates suck -- I've felt the need to duct tape my boobs in Arkansas, Missouri, and Lousiana> :).....we even have to pay fuel tax for every mile driven in a state whether we fueled there or not. How many cars does it take to equal 80,000? I don't know...I'm asking. :) They could pay their share.


They do.

If we all went on strike the president would order all commercial drivers back on the road...shoot this president would label those who didn't comply as terrorists. :)

Truckers would never go on strike. They are not on the same page with each
other.

JWB wrote: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:401885DB.15B29184@joimail.com... JWB wrote: Does your husband speed in his truck? No, he's an independent contractor so any fuel lost by speeding is money lost. He also freezes his *** of rather than idling all night to conserve fuel. If he doesn't speed, he'd be the first trucker I ever saw that did not. But I will take your word for it.

Rookie and company driver stuff -- he sped in his young days...ran
illegal logs...the works....now that he pays the fuel and he has more to
support than logbook tickets pretty much makes him run straight and
narrow.
I think you did mention "drunk truckdrivers" in your original definition but maybe it was someone else. Not I I don't think it's 60/40% but it's probably increasing as more independent drivers get out and more big corporation <equivilant to "sweatshops" in the walmart discussion> company drivers come in. The big corporations recruit drivers out of areas where people are looking for an "honest living" rather than selling crack......I know the difference between the two just by looking at the truck and naturally stay away from them on the road <at my husband's request>. Even though they aren't all cracktown recruits ALOT are inexperienced.....big companies tend to toss two rookies together in the truck hoping four eyes are better than two.....and also own their own insurance companies. But it's still not as BAD as portrayed.....the odds of being killed by the other car, hummer, SUV are MUCH HIGHER. I agree. But in a collision, the odds are higher of dying if you collide with a truck.

So we're about on the same page now. :) Always love talking shop with
ya, JWB. :)

amy

JWB wrote: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:40188756.31DD06D0@joimail.com... . They were built for military movement then moved to commerce then the general public was allowed. Actually, the IHS was always envisioned to be partially paid for by tolls and gasoline taxes. Kinda silly to charge the military, right? It was not "just" built for military movement then expanded to commerce then again to "allow" the general public. It was built for the well being of the country, and made sure that it was big enough to move troops. The autobahn was the inspiration. It was never "gee, now that we have this, we should let cars on this thing too" But trucks pay to maintain the roads Cars do too. <where the hell the money goes no one knows since half the interstates suck -- I've felt the need to duct tape my boobs in Arkansas, Missouri, and Lousiana> :).....we even have to pay fuel tax for every mile driven in a state whether we fueled there or not. How many cars does it take to equal 80,000? I don't know...I'm asking. :) They could pay their share. They do. If we all went on strike the president would order all commercial drivers back on the road...shoot this president would label those who didn't comply as terrorists. :) Truckers would never go on strike. They are not on the same page with each other.

No, trucking is too individualized....a "self-governing" type of
job....but actually it's illegal according to the Fair Trade Act.
Trucking companies can't band together to set freight rates. The
company driver can't do anything but go to his employer and truck
company owners <whether they own 1 or 2000 trucks> can't band
together...so any "flack" from the company drivers <who are the majority
now> only loses their job. They can't fire them but they can sure
starve them out. There is the union sector......all the union stuff is
still a little foggy to me :)....but it's also the minority and doesn't
have alot of influence.

Anyway, going on strike to raise freight rates wouldn't help us in the
least. If freight rates DID rise <which haven't risen since the 70's
although we all know how much the cost of living has risen since then>
it would be shoved off on the consumer. Since we are also consumers it
wouldn't change a darn thing financially.

amy

"Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message
news:40189AA8.A517BBC5@joimail.com... JWB wrote: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:401885DB.15B29184@joimail.com... JWB wrote: > Does your husband speed in his truck? No, he's an independent contractor so any fuel lost by speeding is
money lost. He also freezes his *** of rather than idling all night to conserve fuel. If he doesn't speed, he'd be the first trucker I ever saw that did not.
But I will take your word for it. Rookie and company driver stuff -- he sped in his young days...ran illegal logs...the works....now that he pays the fuel and he has more to support than logbook tickets pretty much makes him run straight and narrow.

I'm happy to hear that.

I think you did mention "drunk truckdrivers" in your original
definition but maybe it was someone else. Not I I don't think it's 60/40% but it's probably increasing as more independent drivers get out and more big corporation <equivilant to "sweatshops" in the walmart discussion> company drivers come in. The big corporations recruit drivers out of areas where people are looking for an "honest living" rather than selling crack......I know the difference between the two just by looking at the truck and naturally stay away from them on the road <at my husband's request>. Even
though they aren't all cracktown recruits ALOT are inexperienced.....big companies tend to toss two rookies together in the truck hoping four eyes are better than two.....and also own their own insurance
companies. But it's still not as BAD as portrayed.....the odds of being killed by the other car, hummer, SUV are MUCH HIGHER. I agree. But in a collision, the odds are higher of dying if you collide with a truck. So we're about on the same page now. :) Always love talking shop with ya, JWB. :)

Back atcha!

Amy D wrote: JWB wrote: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:401885DB.15B29184@joimail.com... JWB wrote:> Does your husband speed in his truck? No, he's an independent contractor so any fuel lost by speeding is money lost. He also freezes his *** of rather than idling all night to conserve fuel. If he doesn't speed, he'd be the first trucker I ever saw that did not. But I will take your word for it. Rookie and company driver stuff -- he sped in his young days...ran illegal logs...the works....now that he pays the fuel and he has more to support than logbook tickets pretty much makes him run straight and narrow. I think you did mention "drunk truckdrivers" in your original definition but maybe it was someone else. Not I I don't think it's 60/40% but it's probably increasing as more independent drivers get out and more big corporation <equivilant to "sweatshops" in the walmart discussion> company drivers come in. The big corporations recruit drivers out of areas where people are looking for an "honest living" rather than selling crack......I know the difference between the two just by looking at the truck and naturally stay away from them on the road <at my husband's request>. Even though they aren't all cracktown recruits ALOT are inexperienced.....big companies tend to toss two rookies together in the truck hoping four eyes are better than two.....and also own their own insurance companies. But it's still not as BAD as portrayed.....the odds of being killed by the other car, hummer, SUV are MUCH HIGHER. I agree. But in a collision, the odds are higher of dying if you collide with a truck. So we're about on the same page now. :) Always love talking shop with ya, JWB. :) amy

We ought to rename this the truck driving and responsibility thread!

"Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message
news:401D3781.51776756@joimail.com... "Bill in Co." wrote: Amy D wrote: JWB wrote:>> "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message> news:401885DB.15B29184@joimail.com...>>>>>> JWB wrote:>>>> Does your husband speed in his truck?>>>> No, he's an independent contractor so any fuel lost by speeding is
money>> lost. He also freezes his *** of rather than idling all night to>> conserve fuel.>> If he doesn't speed, he'd be the first trucker I ever saw that did
not. But> I will take your word for it. Rookie and company driver stuff -- he sped in his young days...ran illegal logs...the works....now that he pays the fuel and he has more
to support than logbook tickets pretty much makes him run straight and narrow.>>>>> I think you did mention "drunk truckdrivers" in your original
definition>> but maybe it was someone else.>> Not I>>>>> I don't think it's 60/40% but it's probably increasing as more>> independent drivers get out and more big corporation <equivilant to>> "sweatshops" in the walmart discussion> company drivers come in.
The>> big corporations recruit drivers out of areas where people are
looking>> for an "honest living" rather than selling crack......I know the>> difference between the two just by looking at the truck and
naturally>> stay away from them on the road <at my husband's request>. Even
though>> they aren't all cracktown recruits ALOT are inexperienced.....big>> companies tend to toss two rookies together in the truck hoping four>> eyes are better than two.....and also own their own insurance
companies.>>>> But it's still not as BAD as portrayed.....the odds of being killed
by>> the other car, hummer, SUV are MUCH HIGHER.>> I agree. But in a collision, the odds are higher of dying if you
collide> with a truck. So we're about on the same page now. :) Always love talking shop with ya, JWB. :) amy We ought to rename this the truck driving and responsibility thread! Actually, I doubt JWB realizes how totally beneficial these conversations are to my marriage. Once or twice a year my husband <understandably> hits driver burn-out. At these times it is my responsibility to be the voice of reason even if I am mired as deep in the muck of the trucking industry as he is at the time. JWB always has a way of helping me pull myself into the "big picture" so I can be objective to counteract his burnout. :) Kind of like it's my husband's job to be the voice of reason when I'm totally wrapped up in utter parenting chaos. He is able to provide the "outside" view.

Geez, that's nice to hear. :)

I do like talking the truck thing, because it was an interesting time in my
life.

"Bill in Co." wrote: Amy D wrote: JWB wrote: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:401885DB.15B29184@joimail.com...>>> JWB wrote:>> Does your husband speed in his truck?>> No, he's an independent contractor so any fuel lost by speeding is money> lost. He also freezes his *** of rather than idling all night to> conserve fuel. If he doesn't speed, he'd be the first trucker I ever saw that did not. But I will take your word for it. Rookie and company driver stuff -- he sped in his young days...ran illegal logs...the works....now that he pays the fuel and he has more to support than logbook tickets pretty much makes him run straight and narrow.>> I think you did mention "drunk truckdrivers" in your original definition> but maybe it was someone else. Not I>> I don't think it's 60/40% but it's probably increasing as more> independent drivers get out and more big corporation <equivilant to> "sweatshops" in the walmart discussion> company drivers come in. The> big corporations recruit drivers out of areas where people are looking> for an "honest living" rather than selling crack......I know the> difference between the two just by looking at the truck and naturally> stay away from them on the road <at my husband's request>. Even though> they aren't all cracktown recruits ALOT are inexperienced.....big> companies tend to toss two rookies together in the truck hoping four> eyes are better than two.....and also own their own insurance companies.>> But it's still not as BAD as portrayed.....the odds of being killed by> the other car, hummer, SUV are MUCH HIGHER. I agree. But in a collision, the odds are higher of dying if you collide with a truck. So we're about on the same page now. :) Always love talking shop with ya, JWB. :) amy We ought to rename this the truck driving and responsibility thread!

Actually, I doubt JWB realizes how totally beneficial these
conversations are to my marriage. Once or twice a year my husband
<understandably> hits driver burn-out. At these times it is my
responsibility to be the voice of reason even if I am mired as deep in
the muck of the trucking industry as he is at the time. JWB always has
a way of helping me pull myself into the "big picture" so I can be
objective to counteract his burnout. :)

Kind of like it's my husband's job to be the voice of reason when I'm
totally wrapped up in utter parenting chaos. He is able to provide the
"outside" view.

amy

Amy D wrote: "Bill in Co." wrote: Amy D wrote: JWB wrote:>> "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message> news:401885DB.15B29184@joimail.com...>>>>>> JWB wrote:>>>> Does your husband speed in his truck?>>>> No, he's an independent contractor so any fuel lost by speeding is>> money lost. He also freezes his *** of rather than idling all night>> to conserve fuel.>> If he doesn't speed, he'd be the first trucker I ever saw that did> not. But I will take your word for it. Rookie and company driver stuff -- he sped in his young days...ran illegal logs...the works....now that he pays the fuel and he has more to support than logbook tickets pretty much makes him run straight and narrow.>>>>> I think you did mention "drunk truckdrivers" in your original>> definition but maybe it was someone else.>> Not I>>>>> I don't think it's 60/40% but it's probably increasing as more>> independent drivers get out and more big corporation <equivilant to>> "sweatshops" in the walmart discussion> company drivers come in. The>> big corporations recruit drivers out of areas where people are>> looking for an "honest living" rather than selling crack......I know>> the difference between the two just by looking at the truck and>> naturally stay away from them on the road <at my husband's request>.>> Even though they aren't all cracktown recruits ALOT are>> inexperienced.....big companies tend to toss two rookies together in>> the truck hoping four eyes are better than two.....and also own>> their own insurance companies.>>>> But it's still not as BAD as portrayed.....the odds of being killed>> by the other car, hummer, SUV are MUCH HIGHER.>> I agree. But in a collision, the odds are higher of dying if you> collide with a truck. So we're about on the same page now. :) Always love talking shop with ya, JWB. :) amy We ought to rename this the truck driving and responsibility thread! Actually, I doubt JWB realizes how totally beneficial these conversations are to my marriage. Once or twice a year my husband <understandably> hits driver burn-out. At these times it is my responsibility to be the voice of reason even if I am mired as deep in the muck of the trucking industry as he is at the time. JWB always has a way of helping me pull myself into the "big picture" so I can be objective to counteract his burnout. :) Kind of like it's my husband's job to be the voice of reason when I'm totally wrapped up in utter parenting chaos. He is able to provide the "outside" view. amy

OK - sounds like a good perspective. I wasn't exactly sure what you meant by
his "driver burn out", but I presume that means he gets fed up with some of the
bull**** he has to put up with in it, and/or he feels he's tired of doing it
for a living (at least on some days).

"Bill in Co." wrote: Amy D wrote: "Bill in Co." wrote: Amy D wrote:> JWB wrote:>>>> "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message>> news:401885DB.15B29184@joimail.com...>>>>>>>>> JWB wrote:>>>>>> Does your husband speed in his truck?>>>>>> No, he's an independent contractor so any fuel lost by speeding is>>> money lost. He also freezes his *** of rather than idling all night>>> to conserve fuel.>>>> If he doesn't speed, he'd be the first trucker I ever saw that did>> not. But I will take your word for it.>> Rookie and company driver stuff -- he sped in his young days...ran> illegal logs...the works....now that he pays the fuel and he has more> to support than logbook tickets pretty much makes him run straight and> narrow.>>>>>>>>> I think you did mention "drunk truckdrivers" in your original>>> definition but maybe it was someone else.>>>> Not I>>>>>>>> I don't think it's 60/40% but it's probably increasing as more>>> independent drivers get out and more big corporation <equivilant to>>> "sweatshops" in the walmart discussion> company drivers come in. The>>> big corporations recruit drivers out of areas where people are>>> looking for an "honest living" rather than selling crack......I know>>> the difference between the two just by looking at the truck and>>> naturally stay away from them on the road <at my husband's request>.>>> Even though they aren't all cracktown recruits ALOT are>>> inexperienced.....big companies tend to toss two rookies together in>>> the truck hoping four eyes are better than two.....and also own>>> their own insurance companies.>>>>>> But it's still not as BAD as portrayed.....the odds of being killed>>> by the other car, hummer, SUV are MUCH HIGHER.>>>> I agree. But in a collision, the odds are higher of dying if you>> collide with a truck.>> So we're about on the same page now. :) Always love talking shop with> ya, JWB. :)>> amy We ought to rename this the truck driving and responsibility thread! Actually, I doubt JWB realizes how totally beneficial these conversations are to my marriage. Once or twice a year my husband <understandably> hits driver burn-out. At these times it is my responsibility to be the voice of reason even if I am mired as deep in the muck of the trucking industry as he is at the time. JWB always has a way of helping me pull myself into the "big picture" so I can be objective to counteract his burnout. :) Kind of like it's my husband's job to be the voice of reason when I'm totally wrapped up in utter parenting chaos. He is able to provide the "outside" view. amy OK - sounds like a good perspective. I wasn't exactly sure what you meant by his "driver burn out", but I presume that means he gets fed up with some of the bull**** he has to put up with in it, and/or he feels he's tired of doing it for a living (at least on some days).

Actually, this burnout is a little different I think so it is sending up
some red flags. Normal burnout for him is he needs to take a week-10
days off rather than "stop through the house for a couple days every six
weeks".

This one in particular I think was brought on by "the baby". The baby
never really cared one way or another if he was here or not since he has
been running this gig since he was born. It's been really hard on our
older child who has spent alot of time with him. But the baby always
thought he was cool since we usually had chocolate birthday cake or
celebrated a holiday when he showed up but he was no big deal. NOW,
they are developing a bond and I think it's going to make him crack.

Normal signs of burnout?

Money arguments.....I often miss this sign and don't de-personalize it.
:)

But I usually figure it out once we are ready to "divorce". LOL

THIS time I'm seeing bigger signs....normally he's a "star driver" and
"contractor of the month"......he hasn't been late for an appointment
yet but he's having a really hard time keeping the truck moving down the
road.

He's talking increasing life insurance. <I know that sounds really
dramamtic but he'll do that occassionally in "normal burnout"--his way
of communicating "I can't provide for you....">.

He dropped an empty trailer on the ground because the kingpin didn't
latch. And he didn't even see that as a sign......

And the not so subtle sign, "I need to do something but I don't know
what!"

I'm actually surrounded by a good support system in this life but it
seems at my moments of "bucking up and pulling myself together" to be
the objective one JWB always manages to snap me out of it the fastest.
:) Not that he ever changes my mind on my beliefs about trucking but
somehow he makes an excellent sounding board so I can draw out what I
need to right now. It does always seem that as soon as I have to snap
out of it some dumb truckdriver does something incredibly stupid like
fumbling for a cellphone and killing a kindergartener about to get on a
bus which floods the trucking newsgroup with all the radical
truck-haters and I find myself defending an industry that is causing
upheaval in my life. And in my other support circles I'm stuck in the
middle. I have a group of mentors and even my own batch of
trainees...but I've been around long enough that the "mentor group" kind
of brushes it off as "I know how to handle this" and my trainee circle
is still in the honeymoon phase so I have to sugar coat it a
little....anyway, JWB always manages to help me pull it all together.
:) So sorry ya'll for boring you!

amy

JWB wrote: "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message news:401D3781.51776756@joimail.com... "Bill in Co." wrote: Amy D wrote: > JWB wrote: >> >> "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message >> news:401885DB.15B29184@joimail.com... >>> >>> >>> JWB wrote: >> >>>> Does your husband speed in his truck? >>> >>> No, he's an independent contractor so any fuel lost by speeding is money >>> lost. He also freezes his *** of rather than idling all night to >>> conserve fuel. >> >> If he doesn't speed, he'd be the first trucker I ever saw that did not. But >> I will take your word for it. > > Rookie and company driver stuff -- he sped in his young days...ran > illegal logs...the works....now that he pays the fuel and he has more to > support than logbook tickets pretty much makes him run straight and > narrow. > >> >>> >>> I think you did mention "drunk truckdrivers" in your original definition >>> but maybe it was someone else. >> >> Not I >> >>> >>> I don't think it's 60/40% but it's probably increasing as more >>> independent drivers get out and more big corporation <equivilant to >>> "sweatshops" in the walmart discussion> company drivers come in. The >>> big corporations recruit drivers out of areas where people are looking >>> for an "honest living" rather than selling crack......I know the >>> difference between the two just by looking at the truck and naturally >>> stay away from them on the road <at my husband's request>. Even though >>> they aren't all cracktown recruits ALOT are inexperienced.....big >>> companies tend to toss two rookies together in the truck hoping four >>> eyes are better than two.....and also own their own insurance companies. >>> >>> But it's still not as BAD as portrayed.....the odds of being killed by >>> the other car, hummer, SUV are MUCH HIGHER. >> >> I agree. But in a collision, the odds are higher of dying if you collide >> with a truck. > > So we're about on the same page now. :) Always love talking shop with > ya, JWB. :) > > amy We ought to rename this the truck driving and responsibility thread! Actually, I doubt JWB realizes how totally beneficial these conversations are to my marriage. Once or twice a year my husband <understandably> hits driver burn-out. At these times it is my responsibility to be the voice of reason even if I am mired as deep in the muck of the trucking industry as he is at the time. JWB always has a way of helping me pull myself into the "big picture" so I can be objective to counteract his burnout. :) Kind of like it's my husband's job to be the voice of reason when I'm totally wrapped up in utter parenting chaos. He is able to provide the "outside" view. Geez, that's nice to hear. :) I do like talking the truck thing, because it was an interesting time in my life.

LOL--I can't explain it. I remember the first time we talked truck I
literally hated you. Although I was pretty miserable in my life. :)

But it's like a barometer to me -- once I lose that "you are looking
down your nose" feeling I described I know I'm on top of my game. And
it doesn't work with just anyone -- sometimes when I lose that feeling
I'm just downright defensive, bitter, and terminally unique. :) It
would never work if I just posted a thread saying "JWB, I need to talk
truck" though -- it has to catch me off guard and it always happens at
the right moment. SO I guess everyone is just going to have to suffer
through it once or twice a year. :)

amy

Amy D wrote: "Bill in Co." wrote: Amy D wrote: "Bill in Co." wrote:>> Amy D wrote:>> JWB wrote:>>>>>> "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message>>> news:401885DB.15B29184@joimail.com...>>>>>>>>>>>> JWB wrote:>>>>>>>> Does your husband speed in his truck?>>>>>>>> No, he's an independent contractor so any fuel lost by speeding>>>> is money lost. He also freezes his *** of rather than idling>>>> all night to conserve fuel.>>>>>> If he doesn't speed, he'd be the first trucker I ever saw that did>>> not. But I will take your word for it.>>>> Rookie and company driver stuff -- he sped in his young days...ran>> illegal logs...the works....now that he pays the fuel and he has>> more to support than logbook tickets pretty much makes him run>> straight and narrow.>>>>>>>>>>>>> I think you did mention "drunk truckdrivers" in your original>>>> definition but maybe it was someone else.>>>>>> Not I>>>>>>>>>>> I don't think it's 60/40% but it's probably increasing as more>>>> independent drivers get out and more big corporation <equivilant>>>> to "sweatshops" in the walmart discussion> company drivers come>>>> in. The big corporations recruit drivers out of areas where>>>> people are looking for an "honest living" rather than selling>>>> crack......I know the difference between the two just by looking>>>> at the truck and naturally stay away from them on the road <at>>>> my husband's request>. Even though they aren't all cracktown>>>> recruits ALOT are inexperienced.....big companies tend to toss>>>> two rookies together in the truck hoping four eyes are better>>>> than two.....and also own their own insurance companies.>>>>>>>> But it's still not as BAD as portrayed.....the odds of being>>>> killed by the other car, hummer, SUV are MUCH HIGHER.>>>>>> I agree. But in a collision, the odds are higher of dying if you>>> collide with a truck.>>>> So we're about on the same page now. :) Always love talking shop>> with ya, JWB. :)>>>> amy>> We ought to rename this the truck driving and responsibility thread! Actually, I doubt JWB realizes how totally beneficial these conversations are to my marriage. Once or twice a year my husband <understandably> hits driver burn-out. At these times it is my responsibility to be the voice of reason even if I am mired as deep in the muck of the trucking industry as he is at the time. JWB always has a way of helping me pull myself into the "big picture" so I can be objective to counteract his burnout. :) Kind of like it's my husband's job to be the voice of reason when I'm totally wrapped up in utter parenting chaos. He is able to provide the "outside" view. amy OK - sounds like a good perspective. I wasn't exactly sure what you meant by his "driver burn out", but I presume that means he gets fed up with some of the bull**** he has to put up with in it, and/or he feels he's tired of doing it for a living (at least on some days). Actually, this burnout is a little different I think so it is sending up some red flags. Normal burnout for him is he needs to take a week-10 days off rather than "stop through the house for a couple days every six weeks". This one in particular I think was brought on by "the baby". The baby never really cared one way or another if he was here or not since he has been running this gig since he was born. It's been really hard on our older child who has spent alot of time with him. But the baby always thought he was cool since we usually had chocolate birthday cake or celebrated a holiday when he showed up but he was no big deal. NOW, they are developing a bond and I think it's going to make him crack. Normal signs of burnout? Money arguments.....I often miss this sign and don't de-personalize it. :) But I usually figure it out once we are ready to "divorce". LOL THIS time I'm seeing bigger signs....normally he's a "star driver" and "contractor of the month"......he hasn't been late for an appointment yet but he's having a really hard time keeping the truck moving down the road. He's talking increasing life insurance. <I know that sounds really dramamtic but he'll do that occassionally in "normal burnout"--his way of communicating "I can't provide for you....">. He dropped an empty trailer on the ground because the kingpin didn't latch. And he didn't even see that as a sign...... And the not so subtle sign, "I need to do something but I don't know what!" I'm actually surrounded by a good support system in this life but it seems at my moments of "bucking up and pulling myself together" to be the objective one JWB always manages to snap me out of it the fastest. :) Not that he ever changes my mind on my beliefs about trucking but somehow he makes an excellent sounding board so I can draw out what I need to right now. It does always seem that as soon as I have to snap out of it some dumb truckdriver does something incredibly stupid like fumbling for a cellphone and killing a kindergartener about to get on a bus which floods the trucking newsgroup with all the radical truck-haters and I find myself defending an industry that is causing upheaval in my life. And in my other support circles I'm stuck in the middle. I have a group of mentors and even my own batch of trainees...but I've been around long enough that the "mentor group" kind of brushes it off as "I know how to handle this" and my trainee circle is still in the honeymoon phase so I have to sugar coat it a little....anyway, JWB always manages to help me pull it all together. :) So sorry ya'll for boring you! amy

Not in the least. It was interesting to hear about it, Amy.

"Bill in Co." <LostInTime@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:3MhTb.8064$F23.7074@newsread2.news.pas.earthl ink.net... Amy D wrote: "Bill in Co." wrote: Amy D wrote:> "Bill in Co." wrote:>>>> Amy D wrote:>>> JWB wrote:>>>>>>>> "Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message>>>> news:401885DB.15B29184@joimail.com...>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> JWB wrote:>>>>>>>>>> Does your husband speed in his truck?>>>>>>>>>> No, he's an independent contractor so any fuel lost by speeding>>>>> is money lost. He also freezes his *** of rather than idling>>>>> all night to conserve fuel.>>>>>>>> If he doesn't speed, he'd be the first trucker I ever saw that did>>>> not. But I will take your word for it.>>>>>> Rookie and company driver stuff -- he sped in his young days...ran>>> illegal logs...the works....now that he pays the fuel and he has>>> more to support than logbook tickets pretty much makes him run>>> straight and narrow.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I think you did mention "drunk truckdrivers" in your original>>>>> definition but maybe it was someone else.>>>>>>>> Not I>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I don't think it's 60/40% but it's probably increasing as more>>>>> independent drivers get out and more big corporation <equivilant>>>>> to "sweatshops" in the walmart discussion> company drivers come>>>>> in. The big corporations recruit drivers out of areas where>>>>> people are looking for an "honest living" rather than selling>>>>> crack......I know the difference between the two just by looking>>>>> at the truck and naturally stay away from them on the road <at>>>>> my husband's request>. Even though they aren't all cracktown>>>>> recruits ALOT are inexperienced.....big companies tend to toss>>>>> two rookies together in the truck hoping four eyes are better>>>>> than two.....and also own their own insurance companies.>>>>>>>>>> But it's still not as BAD as portrayed.....the odds of being>>>>> killed by the other car, hummer, SUV are MUCH HIGHER.>>>>>>>> I agree. But in a collision, the odds are higher of dying if you>>>> collide with a truck.>>>>>> So we're about on the same page now. :) Always love talking shop>>> with ya, JWB. :)>>>>>> amy>>>> We ought to rename this the truck driving and responsibility thread!>> Actually, I doubt JWB realizes how totally beneficial these> conversations are to my marriage. Once or twice a year my husband> <understandably> hits driver burn-out. At these times it is my> responsibility to be the voice of reason even if I am mired as deep> in the muck of the trucking industry as he is at the time. JWB> always has a way of helping me pull myself into the "big picture" so> I can be objective to counteract his burnout. :)>> Kind of like it's my husband's job to be the voice of reason when I'm> totally wrapped up in utter parenting chaos. He is able to provide> the "outside" view.>> amy OK - sounds like a good perspective. I wasn't exactly sure what you meant by his "driver burn out", but I presume that means he gets fed up with some of the bull**** he has to put up with in it, and/or he feels he's tired of doing it for a living (at least on some days). Actually, this burnout is a little different I think so it is sending up some red flags. Normal burnout for him is he needs to take a week-10 days off rather than "stop through the house for a couple days every six weeks". This one in particular I think was brought on by "the baby". The baby never really cared one way or another if he was here or not since he has been running this gig since he was born. It's been really hard on our older child who has spent alot of time with him. But the baby always thought he was cool since we usually had chocolate birthday cake or celebrated a holiday when he showed up but he was no big deal. NOW, they are developing a bond and I think it's going to make him crack. Normal signs of burnout? Money arguments.....I often miss this sign and don't de-personalize it. :) But I usually figure it out once we are ready to "divorce". LOL THIS time I'm seeing bigger signs....normally he's a "star driver" and "contractor of the month"......he hasn't been late for an appointment yet but he's having a really hard time keeping the truck moving down the road. He's talking increasing life insurance. <I know that sounds really dramamtic but he'll do that occassionally in "normal burnout"--his way of communicating "I can't provide for you....">. He dropped an empty trailer on the ground because the kingpin didn't latch. And he didn't even see that as a sign...... And the not so subtle sign, "I need to do something but I don't know what!" I'm actually surrounded by a good support system in this life but it seems at my moments of "bucking up and pulling myself together" to be the objective one JWB always manages to snap me out of it the fastest. :) Not that he ever changes my mind on my beliefs about trucking but somehow he makes an excellent sounding board so I can draw out what I need to right now. It does always seem that as soon as I have to snap out of it some dumb truckdriver does something incredibly stupid like fumbling for a cellphone and killing a kindergartener about to get on a bus which floods the trucking newsgroup with all the radical truck-haters and I find myself defending an industry that is causing upheaval in my life. And in my other support circles I'm stuck in the middle. I have a group of mentors and even my own batch of trainees...but I've been around long enough that the "mentor group" kind of brushes it off as "I know how to handle this" and my trainee circle is still in the honeymoon phase so I have to sugar coat it a little....anyway, JWB always manages to help me pull it all together. :) So sorry ya'll for boring you! amy Not in the least. It was interesting to hear about it, Amy.

see all the great stuff you're missing out on?

"Amy D" <amykae@joimail.com> wrote in message
news:401DA1FE.9831D040@joimail.com...
LOL--I can't explain it. I remember the first time we talked truck I literally hated you. Although I was pretty miserable in my life. :) But it's like a barometer to me -- once I lose that "you are looking down your nose" feeling I described I know I'm on top of my game. And it doesn't work with just anyone -- sometimes when I lose that feeling I'm just downright defensive, bitter, and terminally unique. :) It would never work if I just posted a thread saying "JWB, I need to talk truck" though -- it has to catch me off guard and it always happens at the right moment. SO I guess everyone is just going to have to suffer through it once or twice a year. :)

well, the one thing I noticed about truckers is the incredible amount of
pride many of them have. Perhaps these conversations draw that out in you.
In other words, you may start thinking "trucking sucks", and then i come
along and say "yea, trucking sucks", and then you say "wait a minute mister,
it doesn't suck, and here's why".

For the record, I really try to never look "down my nose" at anyone. I was
broke for awhile in my life and know what it is like to have a landlord
knocking at my door as I pretend I'm not home.